The Traders' Den  

  The Traders' Den > Where we go to learn ..... > Technobabble > Lossy or Lossless?
 

Notices

Lossy or Lossless? Please use this forum to post spectral and frequency analysis posts about shows you have your doubts about.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 2009-05-05, 07:35 PM
juxtiphi's Avatar
juxtiphi juxtiphi is offline
371.34 GB/2.02 TB/5.56
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
need to know if this is lossy as my torrent was banned at dime

ripped this from a dvd with xmpeg to wav tracked it out and posted at dime banned due to lossy file so Im confused it doesnt look all that lossy to me.

second pic is a 2 second select

thanks guys
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 5-5-2009 7-30-27 PM.jpg
( 200.1 KB, 56 views)
 
File Type: jpg 5-5-2009 7-43-41 PM.jpg
( 204.4 KB, 45 views)
 

Last edited by juxtiphi; 2009-05-05 at 07:44 PM.
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #2  
Old 2009-05-05, 08:45 PM
paddington's Avatar
paddington paddington is offline
please look after this bear
TTD Staff
83.17 GB/882.10 GB/10.61
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: UK
Re: need to know if this is lossy as my torrent was banned at dime

always deselect before doing the screenshot to get rid of the white haze...

but no, I don't think that is lossy at all.

the squeal just below 16kHz is flyback noise from a CRT that got into the transfer, most likely...

what was their criteria for calling it lossy?
__________________
"There are some of these recordings where it is just a whirring, and you cannot hear the music. " - Jimmy Page, 2007 / JUL / 26
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #3  
Old 2009-05-05, 09:45 PM
juxtiphi's Avatar
juxtiphi juxtiphi is offline
371.34 GB/2.02 TB/5.56
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Re: need to know if this is lossy as my torrent was banned at dime

Quote:
Originally Posted by jameskg View Post
always deselect before doing the screenshot to get rid of the white haze...

but no, I don't think that is lossy at all.

the squeal just below 16kHz is flyback noise from a CRT that got into the transfer, most likely...

what was their criteria for calling it lossy?

hi james thanks for replying


I extracted the audio via xmpeg to wav looked good to me then I get this email,


Banned by site Mod Reason
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lossy.

According to the description, the audio files in this torrent are sourced from the AC3 audio in the DVD running at http://www.dimeadozen.org/torrents-d....php?id=246076.

Lossy files bloated to FLAC are not allowed on DIME. Only the original soundstream in its native format can be torrented


so what does that mean? I have never seen any torrents where the files were all ac3 or even one big file.

audio of this show was previously posted by ricola but it was incomplete and full of digi noise plus the wrong date but that fuck up is still running I did a lot of work to post that show especially on the sound enhanced version (some 30 hours) and what gets me is I have some shows from dime that turned out to be lossy but those torrents were never banned and they were not the only version available.

its almost not worth the effort to try and bring something good to people now a days as theres always some wanker pissin on the parade.


thanks and take care
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #4  
Old 2009-05-05, 10:18 PM
paddington's Avatar
paddington paddington is offline
please look after this bear
TTD Staff
83.17 GB/882.10 GB/10.61
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: UK
Re: need to know if this is lossy as my torrent was banned at dime

he may be assuming...

did the audio come from a DVD that was encoded with AC3? AC3 is lossy and much harder to detect on a spectrum analyzer than MP3 is.

or did it come from a different source?
__________________
"There are some of these recordings where it is just a whirring, and you cannot hear the music. " - Jimmy Page, 2007 / JUL / 26
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #5  
Old 2009-05-05, 10:53 PM
juxtiphi's Avatar
juxtiphi juxtiphi is offline
371.34 GB/2.02 TB/5.56
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Re: need to know if this is lossy as my torrent was banned at dime

Quote:
Originally Posted by jameskg View Post
he may be assuming...

did the audio come from a DVD that was encoded with AC3? AC3 is lossy and much harder to detect on a spectrum analyzer than MP3 is.

or did it come from a different source?
mine was sourced from this
PAL DVD
audio: DD 256kb/s 48khz
aspect ratio 4x3
bitrate 9578 kbps

total time approx. 60 minutes

VHS Proshot Master > stand-alone dvd recorder >DVDr >PC > dime

ricolas was sourced from this

SOURCE: POLISH TV BROADCAST>VHS MAXELL HIFI TAPE>Audio Rip>CDR>trade>EAC Secure>HDD>Flac Frontend, Level 5

his is not lossy but its way fugged up in other ways which in my mind means it shouldnt be running at all. its fine if you want it for your self but why post a crappy rip?


plus I didnt know that ac3 was lossy but why allow a video but not an audio recording from the same dvd? it doesnt make sense to me lossy shopud be lossy no? and not for nothin but mine is way better sounding.
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #6  
Old 2009-05-05, 11:30 PM
paddington's Avatar
paddington paddington is offline
please look after this bear
TTD Staff
83.17 GB/882.10 GB/10.61
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: UK
Re: need to know if this is lossy as my torrent was banned at dime

Quote:
audio: DD 256kb/s 48khz
the DD is Dolby Digital - that's AC3. Though AC3 is a good codec, much better than standard rate mp3, he's right, it's lossy.
Sorry.
__________________
"There are some of these recordings where it is just a whirring, and you cannot hear the music. " - Jimmy Page, 2007 / JUL / 26
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #7  
Old 2009-05-05, 11:40 PM
juxtiphi's Avatar
juxtiphi juxtiphi is offline
371.34 GB/2.02 TB/5.56
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Re: need to know if this is lossy as my torrent was banned at dime

Quote:
Originally Posted by jameskg View Post
the DD is Dolby Digital - that's AC3. Though AC3 is a good codec, much better than standard rate mp3, he's right, it's lossy.
Sorry.
no prob james thanks for looking into it
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #8  
Old 2009-05-10, 10:36 AM
juxtiphi's Avatar
juxtiphi juxtiphi is offline
371.34 GB/2.02 TB/5.56
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Re: need to know if this is lossy as my torrent was banned at dime

this is the kind of crap im talking about


its a 2 second selection and this looks lossy to me but its allowed to live at dime.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 5-10-2009 9-11-52 AM.jpg
( 207.8 KB, 157 views)
 
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #9  
Old 2009-05-12, 03:11 AM
Five's Avatar
Five Five is offline
TTD Staff
186.65 GB/588.32 GB/3.15
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Canada
Re: need to know if this is lossy as my torrent was banned at dime

^this last one is minidisc, which is an exception to the 'no lossy' policy...

ac3 is difficult to spot, main indication is the abrupt cutoff at 20kHz which can be seen in your shots... of course there's more going on below that line, but as james said its one of the better lossy codecs.

we don't allow ac3 rips here, either, & there's too much ac3 on DVDs to ban it outright in both the audo and video section. the audio should just stay with the video in our opinion!

so anyhow, this isn't a case of dime being overly strict (as some people have said they can be..), we would approach it the exact same way at this site.
__________________
Checksums Demystified EAC Config MakeTorrent WinAmp Config

Modern social theory casts a highly skeptical eye on any declaration that a group of persons is without conflict, and insists, on the contrary, that conflict is natural to groups, and even more, is essential to them. -Patrick Henry
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #10  
Old 2009-05-18, 11:40 AM
deivas77 deivas77 is offline
2.27 GB/8.18 GB/3.60
 
Join Date: May 2008
Re: need to know if this is lossy as my torrent was banned at dime

Five
"SOURCE: POLISH TV BROADCAST>VHS MAXELL HIFI TAPE>Audio Rip>CDR>trade>EAC Secure>HDD>Flac Frontend, Level 5 "
I don`t understand... By you "this last one is minidisc". I don`t see MD in lineage...?
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #11  
Old 2009-05-18, 06:36 PM
paddington's Avatar
paddington paddington is offline
please look after this bear
TTD Staff
83.17 GB/882.10 GB/10.61
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: UK
Re: need to know if this is lossy as my torrent was banned at dime

Quote:
Originally Posted by deivas77 View Post
Five
"SOURCE: POLISH TV BROADCAST>VHS MAXELL HIFI TAPE>Audio Rip>CDR>trade>EAC Secure>HDD>Flac Frontend, Level 5 "
I don`t understand... By you "this last one is minidisc". I don`t see MD in lineage...?
He means post #8 (last one before his), not the last one of the original group of posts. The lineage you have quote is from a few posts before that.


As for Post #8 - I'd say that could well be higher BR MP3 (just based on the rolloff freq being slightly higher (17k) than common MP3s which are usually 128-160 or so). Maybe 256k... 320 usually rolls off just before 20k...

Five, are you calling it MD because the rolloff is higher? Just curious as to what your tell-flag is.
__________________
"There are some of these recordings where it is just a whirring, and you cannot hear the music. " - Jimmy Page, 2007 / JUL / 26
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #12  
Old 2009-05-19, 12:42 PM
deivas77 deivas77 is offline
2.27 GB/8.18 GB/3.60
 
Join Date: May 2008
Re: need to know if this is lossy as my torrent was banned at dime

I think, in post #8 is screenshot from "looks lossy to me but its allowed to live at dime", so I was right
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #13  
Old 2009-05-19, 01:19 PM
paddington's Avatar
paddington paddington is offline
please look after this bear
TTD Staff
83.17 GB/882.10 GB/10.61
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: UK
Re: need to know if this is lossy as my torrent was banned at dime

Quote:
Originally Posted by deivas77 View Post
I think, in post #8 is screenshot from "looks lossy to me but its allowed to live at dime", so I was right
ok, you may be right, if you wish. No problem.
__________________
"There are some of these recordings where it is just a whirring, and you cannot hear the music. " - Jimmy Page, 2007 / JUL / 26
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #14  
Old 2009-05-19, 01:42 PM
Five's Avatar
Five Five is offline
TTD Staff
186.65 GB/588.32 GB/3.15
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Canada
Re: need to know if this is lossy as my torrent was banned at dime

Quote:
Originally Posted by jameskg View Post
Five, are you calling it MD because the rolloff is higher? Just curious as to what your tell-flag is.
yeah, cutoff is higher and distinctive 'parapet' structure as seen here posts 3 & 5

quick guide to spotting ATRAC
hume_castle.jpg
__________________
Checksums Demystified EAC Config MakeTorrent WinAmp Config

Modern social theory casts a highly skeptical eye on any declaration that a group of persons is without conflict, and insists, on the contrary, that conflict is natural to groups, and even more, is essential to them. -Patrick Henry
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #15  
Old 2009-05-19, 02:00 PM
paddington's Avatar
paddington paddington is offline
please look after this bear
TTD Staff
83.17 GB/882.10 GB/10.61
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: UK
Re: need to know if this is lossy as my torrent was banned at dime

thx
__________________
"There are some of these recordings where it is just a whirring, and you cannot hear the music. " - Jimmy Page, 2007 / JUL / 26
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
Reply

The Traders' Den > Where we go to learn ..... > Technobabble > Lossy or Lossless?

Similar Threads
Thread Forum Replies Last Post
System of a Down torrent -- Is this lossy? - Gordy Lossy or Lossless? 2 2007-07-28 01:25 PM


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forums


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:53 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - , TheTradersDen.org - All Rights Reserved - Hosted at QuickPacket
no new posts