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View Poll Results: Should we ban mindless leechers?
Yes, If their share ratio is less than 1.0 27 4.04%
Yes, If their share ratio is less than 0.75 29 4.34%
Yes, If their share ratio is less than 0.50 131 19.61%
Yes, If their share ratio is less than 0.25 157 23.50%
No, not under any circumstances. Let karma take over! 201 30.09%
Give them a warning and allow them to make up for their wrongdoing by ul'ing constantly. 176 26.35%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 668. You may not vote on this poll

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  #286  
Old 2009-05-19, 11:57 AM
Cornelious Jerome Garcia Oppenheimer Cornelious Jerome Garcia Oppenheimer is offline
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Re: Should we ban thoughtless leechers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by nameloc01 View Post
Torrenting=not good.

-It enables and encourages the "instant gratification" mentality.
Do you grow your own food? How about your own weed? Build your own car? Paint all of your own artwork?

Instant gratification does not always equate to laziness. The internet has given all of us the ability to get some things quickly, be it shows, information, airline tickets, porn, or casual encounters with strangers

Yes, some will always exploit that. But stating that as a whole bit torrent is not good because of those few. I just don't understand. I see plenty of ratios on bt sites that show there are still people that give very generously, and kind enough to explain it to newbies in a way that is not self-righteous or attacking them.

I also can't grasp how someone can say that this medium for trading/exchanging is bad. I used to go through a boatload of bubble mailers, postage, and in essence a lot of resources (postal workers salaries, gas, vehicles, CDR's, sometimes planes I imagine) just to get a nice set of SHN's to someone on the east coast or out of the country. Now, I can serve them and access them in a much more eco friendly way IMO.

Quote:
-It does not foster a sense of community that is present amongst "real" traders.
Disagree. I have been a 'real' trader for a very long time, before online trading. I have fostered more friendships and been a part of, and help create communities that people choose the level they wish to participate in. If someone wants to become a part of any online community, it is rather simple and easier than hoping that you may have something that is worthy to the person that holding the show you are interested in. Before Sharingthegroove, I had a limited Jazz collection, and I love prince and that snail mail community was almost impossible to get into and I had a hard time even getting a couple of shows. I think if anything it broke up the elitist trading circles and brought a lot of great shows out of woodwork.

Quote:
-It demotes the hobby of taping. People realize they can sit in their basement and push a few buttons thus getting them practically any show they want,without giving the slightest bit of anything back to the "community".
Once again, big generalization. I have been duped a handful of times trading with 'real' traders. Snail Mail leechers are out there too.

I think it actually has brought the hobby of taping to a whole new level. From access to information about equipment to hints/tricks for getting the best out of whatever gear you have. We have a whole sub-forum here dedicated to the hobby of taping. I have seen quite a few people post from their initial questions about equipment, taping, seeding all the way through purchasing the equipment and then eventually posting their first show and watching them get better, posting more shows, and love their new hobby.
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  #287  
Old 2009-05-19, 01:46 PM
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Re: Should we ban thoughtless leechers?

Excellent post Bill.
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  #288  
Old 2009-05-19, 01:54 PM
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daddyray daddyray is offline
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Re: Should we ban thoughtless leechers?

I prefer his posts about undies
__________________
"We're here to have a ball." Art Blakey
"Reality is a hallucination brought on by lack of alcohol." Graham Chapman
"I'll drink to your health til it ruins mine" Art Blakey
"Trust a pro" Keith Richards
"here is my offer: nothing" Mike C
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  #289  
Old 2009-05-19, 03:16 PM
Cornelious Jerome Garcia Oppenheimer Cornelious Jerome Garcia Oppenheimer is offline
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Re: Should we ban thoughtless leechers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dcbullet View Post
Excellent post Bill.
That makes maybe 3 out of 1600.

Quote:
Originally Posted by daddyrayoll
I prefer his posts about undies
I am the 2002 Golden Panty Award Winner.
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  #290  
Old 2009-05-19, 03:21 PM
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daddyray daddyray is offline
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Re: Should we ban thoughtless leechers?

thanks BK that's better
__________________
"We're here to have a ball." Art Blakey
"Reality is a hallucination brought on by lack of alcohol." Graham Chapman
"I'll drink to your health til it ruins mine" Art Blakey
"Trust a pro" Keith Richards
"here is my offer: nothing" Mike C
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  #291  
Old 2009-05-19, 08:27 PM
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Re: Should we ban thoughtless leechers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bill_kate View Post
Do you grow your own food? How about your own weed? Build your own car? Paint all of your own artwork?

Instant gratification does not always equate to laziness. The internet has given all of us the ability to get some things quickly, be it shows, information, airline tickets, porn, or casual encounters with strangers

Yes, some will always exploit that. But stating that as a whole bit torrent is not good because of those few. I just don't understand. I see plenty of ratios on bt sites that show there are still people that give very generously, and kind enough to explain it to newbies in a way that is not self-righteous or attacking them.

I also can't grasp how someone can say that this medium for trading/exchanging is bad. I used to go through a boatload of bubble mailers, postage, and in essence a lot of resources (postal workers salaries, gas, vehicles, CDR's, sometimes planes I imagine) just to get a nice set of SHN's to someone on the east coast or out of the country. Now, I can serve them and access them in a much more eco friendly way IMO.



Disagree. I have been a 'real' trader for a very long time, before online trading. I have fostered more friendships and been a part of, and help create communities that people choose the level they wish to participate in. If someone wants to become a part of any online community, it is rather simple and easier than hoping that you may have something that is worthy to the person that holding the show you are interested in. Before Sharingthegroove, I had a limited Jazz collection, and I love prince and that snail mail community was almost impossible to get into and I had a hard time even getting a couple of shows. I think if anything it broke up the elitist trading circles and brought a lot of great shows out of woodwork.



Once again, big generalization. I have been duped a handful of times trading with 'real' traders. Snail Mail leechers are out there too.

I think it actually has brought the hobby of taping to a whole new level. From access to information about equipment to hints/tricks for getting the best out of whatever gear you have. We have a whole sub-forum here dedicated to the hobby of taping. I have seen quite a few people post from their initial questions about equipment, taping, seeding all the way through purchasing the equipment and then eventually posting their first show and watching them get better, posting more shows, and love their new hobby.
Nice rant, Bill.... still, it's only your opinion.




-----------------

You talk the talk, but have you ever walked the walk?

Still, after all that -- it just doesn't seem that anything ever got you to go out and make any new recordings to add to the trade pool.......
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by jameskg View Post
I don't think I troll anyone, other than freezer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by U2Lynne View Post
You wall-eyed apple-knocking pig-fuckers! You don't know shit!
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  #292  
Old 2009-05-20, 02:00 AM
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LeifH12345 LeifH12345 is offline
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Re: Should we ban thoughtless leechers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeMgdi View Post
As a thoughtless seeder, I have determined that I have little to say and that the opinions here are of low or no value.
>
Quote:
Originally Posted by rspencer View Post
>
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  #293  
Old 2009-05-20, 02:22 AM
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sleepless sleepless is offline
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Re: Should we ban thoughtless leechers?

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeMgdi
As a thoughtless seeder, I have determined that I have little to say and that the opinions here are of low or no value.

>

Quote:
Originally Posted by rspencer


>
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  #294  
Old 2009-05-21, 01:42 PM
Cornelious Jerome Garcia Oppenheimer Cornelious Jerome Garcia Oppenheimer is offline
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Re: Should we ban thoughtless leechers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by freezer View Post
Nice rant, Bill.... still, it's only your opinion.
The whole thread is opinion, captain obvious

Quote:
-----------------

You talk the talk, but have you ever walked the walk?

Still, after all that -- it just doesn't seem that anything ever got you to go out and make any new recordings to add to the trade pool.......
Taping is not for everyone. I personally need to, and do, stay away from any taping I see going on. I get too into the shows myself and plan to stay that way. I like to dance and make noise. Wouldn't make for very good recordings.


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  #295  
Old 2009-05-22, 03:11 AM
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Re: Should we ban thoughtless leechers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bill_kate View Post
The whole thread is opinion, captain obvious
Correct, opinions are like assholes....everybody's got one.

However when you share your opinion on "hoarding" and then just as quickly admit that you refuse to even try to make any recordings, then in my opinion, your credibility got flushed down the crapper, in reference to this hobby.

People who mouth off about "Hoarding" and and also refuse to ever contribute to the trade pool should have no right to mouth off.

You wanna talk the talk, but you refuse to walk the walk?

Are you really serious?

What makes you think you deserve to partake of The Little Red Hen's wheat, when you refuse to help harvest, threshing, milling, or baking the bread?




Quote:
Originally Posted by bill_kate View Post
Taping is not for everyone. I personally need to, and do, stay away from any taping I see going on. I get too into the shows myself and plan to stay that way. I like to dance and make noise. Wouldn't make for very good recordings.
Lame, that's a really lame reply. Sounds like you're already defeated.

Maybe you should learn to take what's offered without demanding anything... instead of rationalizing a truckload of manure there, Major Pain.



If you want to make any noise about "hoarding", then maybe first you need to consider learning to try to give something back.

Stop dancing for ONE show and get proactive toward "YOUR" community.

Or like many tapers already have done....you just might consider paying it forward....sound like a plan?


Oh, and I do understand "sharing", but I also see you sharing your hypocracy here.

Or, hey, consider refraining from ever making remarks about "hoarding" when you absolutely refuse to do anything but take.



And Bill, I like you, really.....people talk bad about you, but I like you.

__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by jameskg View Post
I don't think I troll anyone, other than freezer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by U2Lynne View Post
You wall-eyed apple-knocking pig-fuckers! You don't know shit!
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  #296  
Old 2009-05-22, 12:35 PM
Cornelious Jerome Garcia Oppenheimer Cornelious Jerome Garcia Oppenheimer is offline
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Re: Should we ban thoughtless leechers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by freezer View Post
Correct, opinions are like assholes....everybody's got one.

However when you share your opinion on "hoarding" and then just as quickly admit that you refuse to even try to make any recordings, then in my opinion, your credibility got flushed down the crapper, in reference to this hobby.

People who mouth off about "Hoarding" and and also refuse to ever contribute to the trade pool should have no right to mouth off.
I will continue to mouth off about all mundane topics, as will you.


Quote:
You wanna talk the talk, but you refuse to walk the walk?

Are you really serious?

What makes you think you deserve to partake of The Little Red Hen's wheat, when you refuse to help harvest, threshing, milling, or baking the bread?
I guess i feel "entitled' to everything.

Seriously though, I have contributed to the community for some time. Maybe not taping, but I have given none-the-less. I know you know that, but apparently if you do not tape, it is not contributing in your opinion.

Quote:
Lame, that's a really lame reply. Sounds like you're already defeated.

Maybe you should learn to take what's offered without demanding anything... instead of rationalizing a truckload of manure there, Major Pain.
I merely stated how I felt about the hoarding and waving it front of people, I have tried to say that a number of times. I make no demands, and have not made them in the past for people to share anything they have. But when the topic comes up as it always has, I will continue to ask What is the motivation for talking about the hours of great recordings one may possess, quickly followed with but I will never trade/share them


Quote:
If you want to make any noise about "hoarding", then maybe first you need to consider learning to try to give something back.
again...I have contributed to the community for some time. Maybe not taping, but I have given none-the-less. I know you know that, but apparently if you do not tape, it is not contributing in your opinion.

Quote:
Stop dancing for ONE show and get proactive toward "YOUR" community.
um....no. I prefer to be proactive in other ways. Like trying to pry hoarded shows from tapers hands.
Quote:
Or like many tapers already have done....you just might consider paying it forward....sound like a plan?
I feel as if I have payed it forward, from way back to the AOL rose garden days and offering up many freebies & B-P's to actively vining and branching for trees before bit torrent to giving life to the vine section at STG and spending copius time on that site to spending considerable amounts of time raising this site from the ashes of STG. I will continue to do so, in my non taping fashion.

Quote:
Oh, and I do understand "sharing", but I also see you sharing your hypocracy here.

Or, hey, consider refraining from ever making remarks about "hoarding" when you absolutely refuse to do anything but take.
again....I will continue to mouth off about all mundane topics, as will you

Quote:
And Bill, I like you, really.....people talk bad about you, but I like you.

Right back at you.
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  #297  
Old 2009-05-22, 11:08 PM
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Re: Should we ban thoughtless leechers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bill_kate View Post
I will continue to mouth off about all mundane topics, as will you.

I guess i feel "entitled' to everything.


Including my contempt on this issue, OK?


Your greed is showing through again, Bill.....


Quote:
Originally Posted by bill_kate View Post
What is the motivation for talking about the hours of great recordings one may possess, quickly followed with but I will never trade/share them
Well, maybe you've had a hard time understanding this: "It's none of your fucking business, Bill."

Maybe that's what's the problem, could it be that you don't know how to mind your business even after you're told to go away.



Or maybe you could have shaken something loose, IF you had something unique to offer in return, something you taped???

I guess you'll never know, huh?



Quote:
Originally Posted by bill_kate View Post
again...I have contributed to the community for some time. Maybe not taping, but I have given none-the-less. I know you know that, but apparently if you do not tape, it is not contributing in your opinion.
Jeezus, don't break your arm patting yourself on the back.

This taper thinks you're just a parasite, with the attitude you're exhibiting.

I'm sure I ain't the only one to feel like that.



Quote:
Originally Posted by bill_kate View Post
..um....no. I prefer to be proactive in other ways. Like trying to pry hoarded shows from tapers hands.
Well, I'm absolutely delighted for you, but this taper thinks you should pull your head outta 1968.... Or where-ever else it is that precludes you from understanding just how greedy and myopic you've come across in the last few days.


What I see is that the bus left and you didn't make it.


Personally, the disdain I feel toward this sort of mindset will preclude me from ever listening to that Grateful Dead crap again.

Best of luck to you, but anything I might have taped of those snoozers is at the bottom of the list when it comes to offering anything.

However, as I said many times previously, I trade... And the people I've traded with aren't interested in that mindless noodling either. Sorry (no I not really, I just don't care.)


Quote:
Originally Posted by bill_kate View Post
I feel as if I have payed it forward, from way back to the AOL rose garden days and offering up many freebies & B-P's to actively vining and branching for trees before bit torrent to giving life to the vine section at STG and spending copius time on that site to spending considerable amounts of time raising this site from the ashes of STG. I will continue to do so, in my non taping fashion.
In-breeding -- as you described -- just breeds more inbreeding.

There was a reason STG died the death, and a very, very, very, VERY large percentage of the TTD couldn't care less about that old news.

Your mileage may vary, especially since that 1968 VW bus you're driving can't get uphill any longer.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bill_kate View Post
again....I will continue to mouth off about all mundane topics, as will you....
Riiight....... You tell 'em Major Pain, sing it loud and clear, all the while you're standing alone in the cold rain and snow and preaching to a diminishing choir of similar minded parasites.


It's 40 years on now, Jerry's as dead as all fucking billy-hell, he's copped the last heroin he's ever gonna fix-up -- and you've yet to do anything proactive towards your "community" to keep it from dying steadily, no matter how many times you pat yourself on the back.



Your "entitlement" issues are a disgrace, not a goddam badge of honor.




Quote:
Originally Posted by bill_kate View Post
Right back at you.
BWA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-oh, you sure told me, shucks..... Major.....



If you'd like to continue this, let's take it to the taper's forum, shall we?

Let's leave this thread to all "ratio police" to get back to sneering at vlad's numbers, OK?

We can start a new thread there and let's see if anyone there salutes you, Bill.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by jameskg View Post
I don't think I troll anyone, other than freezer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by U2Lynne View Post
You wall-eyed apple-knocking pig-fuckers! You don't know shit!
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  #298  
Old 2009-05-23, 11:36 AM
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dementrium dementrium is offline
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Re: Should we ban thoughtless leechers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by nameloc01 View Post
Torrenting=not good.

-It enables and encourages the "instant gratification" mentality.
I get a lot of instant gratification with my right hand, and man, is she good. Better than her less skilled sister, the left hand.

Torrenting is also a very good thing. I wonder if, tech speaking, torrent is the last and final word on distributed file sharing, or if some new revolutionary approach will be developed over the next few years.




to self
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  #299  
Old 2009-05-23, 02:29 PM
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Re: Should we ban thoughtless leechers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dementrium View Post
I get a lot of instant gratification with my right hand, and man, is she good. Better than her less skilled sister, the left hand.
Well, at least you have something to do while patiently waiting for a train that isn't gonna be pulling into the station.





Quote:
Originally Posted by dementrium View Post
Torrenting is also a very good thing.
YOUR opinion.

Others feel differently.

The mileage varies, don't it though?

For every positive you see in making music trading more impersonal, there are the same number of negatives.

(For example, not forcing collectors to at least considering to add something new and unique to the trade pool for every something they take. Consider the number of shows NEVER recorded by giving out free rides to anyone with the means to grab and go.)




Quote:
Originally Posted by dementrium View Post
I wonder if, tech speaking, torrent is the last and final word on distributed file sharing, or if some new revolutionary approach will be developed over the next few years.

to self
Garbage in, garbage out.... (lying about lineage, hit and run collectors, passing around high gen copies because it's just too easy to grab and run, "re-masters" of high gen crap copies --because they're from "silver pressed bootlegs" -- supplanting low gens or master copies ....ect etc etc)


Garbage in, garbage out....

New delivery systems don't ensure that what you grabbed is actually what some good "seeder" says it is.

New delivery systems don't ensure the best version, just newer and quicker forms of instant gratification of garbage copies also.

In the almost 5 years that I've been supplying TTD with copies from my master tapes, I'm noticing a new trend: "good" collectors re-mastering my tapes and fucking up their remaster, then circulating it without all the pertinent info.

The NRPS 1976-05-30 recording I made and had offered at TTD first is now making the rounds in an altered form, that is now corrupted.

And that corrupt copy is supplanting the original unblemished master.

Imagine that: someone had to 'monkey' with a master tape for NO other reason than to put their name on it.

A different torrent site is now passing around an mp3 version of something that was first offered here from my master in lossless format.

Imagine that: someone took one of my masters from this site, converted it to mp3, then someone converted that back into analog, then someone turned that back into a digital format.

I eagerly await that version to make the rounds here.

Garbage in, garbage out..... but at least someone else got to add their name to the recording as the "re-master-er" while removing the taper's name and other info.


Don't you just love it? Garbage in, garbage out.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by jameskg View Post
I don't think I troll anyone, other than freezer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by U2Lynne View Post
You wall-eyed apple-knocking pig-fuckers! You don't know shit!
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  #300  
Old 2009-05-23, 02:49 PM
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daddyray daddyray is offline
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Re: Should we ban thoughtless leechers?

I feel entitled to the opinions of others
__________________
"We're here to have a ball." Art Blakey
"Reality is a hallucination brought on by lack of alcohol." Graham Chapman
"I'll drink to your health til it ruins mine" Art Blakey
"Trust a pro" Keith Richards
"here is my offer: nothing" Mike C
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