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  #16  
Old 2005-02-17, 02:03 PM
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Re: A question about speed correction of lossless files

thanks for the info starman... please do keep me updated. When I finally get to my project I'll post all the info about it for anybody who's interested to check out.

btw, I'm curious about using foobar2000 for pitch correction. Can foobar play back a file in real time so that the final time of a WAV is just a little bit shorter? Can you tell me where these settings are and how they're used? I want to use this for yet another project (work-related).
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  #17  
Old 2005-02-17, 04:49 PM
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Re: A question about speed correction of lossless files

errrr... he actually already posted all the info you're asking for. in this very thread, even.

http://www.thetradersden.org/forums/...27&postcount=8
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  #18  
Old 2005-02-17, 04:59 PM
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Re: A question about speed correction of lossless files

Quote:
Originally Posted by Five
thanks for the info starman... please do keep me updated. When I finally get to my project I'll post all the info about it for anybody who's interested to check out.

btw, I'm curious about using foobar2000 for pitch correction. Can foobar play back a file in real time so that the final time of a WAV is just a little bit shorter? Can you tell me where these settings are and how they're used? I want to use this for yet another project (work-related).
That's a good question...wish I knew !
If you go into preferences > playback>DSP Manager > Sound Touch , the controls are there.
( first you have to make sure you've got all that stuff enabled by going into DSP Manager and putting them from the right column into the left column , and remove effects you don't want the same way...my simplest explanation... )
In Sound Touch are the controls for 'Apply Slider Changes In Real Time' , 'Tempo' , 'Rate' and 'Pitch'.
There's a screen shot of the sliders that also pretty much includes the path to them on the previous page of this thread.
They are very sensitive...I had to move the mouse cursor a hair at a time before clicking to get it just right. If I move the slider by holding my left click down , I get what I want but it takes awhile to get used to , especially while hitting a guitar string with my left hand(one time being a lefty came in handy , my left is my natural pick hand).
There may be ways of doing what you're saying in foobar , but I'm not aware of how to use them.
I just managed a rudimentary , but I believe , tonally-accurate way of fixing the pitch on this one show I encountered , using foobar.
See , I'm not sure what tempo he played this show at...he could've rushed through the numbers a little , but the guitar would still be in the right pitch that he tunes in, if it was him hurrying and not the tape recorder/player...know what I mean ? So I just focused on getting the note right and left the timing of the beat to my ear and my pretty much embedded memory of how fast his tunes go....not the mathematically accurate way , I know , but you've given me a new idea :idea2: as far as how to get that corrected using a studio recordings timing as a guide.
If you're shooting where I think you are (took me a minute to catch on !), we'd probably be better off trying to do it with CED or Sound Forge 7.0, which I've got a cracked copy of , but admittedly , the controls on SF might as well be in Greek to me at this point !
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  #19  
Old 2005-02-17, 05:57 PM
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Re: A question about speed correction of lossless files

Audition's speed/pitch correction filter has always unimpressed me.. SoundTouch or whatever Sound Forge has to offer might be the better option.

By the way, no need to pull off mouse acrobatics. You can move sliders (like those in the SoundTouch config) around using the arrow keys as well.
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  #20  
Old 2005-02-17, 11:11 PM
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Re: A question about speed correction of lossless files

On second look at your comment , Five , are you just asking basically to shorten the play time of a file ? That's what I thought at first , then I thought you meant to change the time without having to listen to it , so I modified my comment and came to think you were saying we could change a tempo by submitting a pre-determined value for the software to use as a template of sorts to adjust the speed of the track. However looking again I'm thinking real time is what enables us to hear the track/adjust the track 'on the fly' , so to speak , and that my original interpretation of the question was correct...
This terminology is new to me and I'm not sure what you mean....look forward to your comments , I'm gettin' hooked on trying to learn this....!
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Because we can't get by without [you].
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  #21  
Old 2005-02-18, 01:32 AM
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Re: A question about speed correction of lossless files

I need to shave 50ms off of a separate WAV file to wild sync it with a 12 minute cartoon from pro digital tape. ugh! This is just temporary until we get a SMPTE system wired up. I hope foobar has fine enough controls.

Well, here's the story of pitch shifting, as I know it:

Tape decks always have a pitch control (usually buried somewhere in the circuit board, sometimes can be controlled from the front panel). For years this was the only pitch shifting available. Dead simple, it's a control that adjusts the speed of the motor. Playback at a faster speed, pitch is also increased. Play back at a slower speed, pitch is decreased. Also of importance is that time (& thus tempo) are made shorter or longer sympathtically.

On an analog multitrack machine, all of the tracks run at the same speed. So to affect the pitch of one track means also changing the pich of the other tracks (equally). So, to pitch shift an overdub up a bit the multitrack would have to be run at a slightly slower speed during layering, or vice-versa for pitch shifting down. I'm sure some other more labor-intense strategies were used as well.

Then sometime in the 70's an outrageous new invention called the "Pitch Shifter" was invented. It could digitally alter pitch without altering time with just a tiny lag for processing time. Prices were incredibly high, it still costs around $5000 for an Evantide Ultra-Harmonizer.

Now we have all this and more in software.

So, in the case of a tape of a show, when you can hear the speed is all wrong, it means your deck isn't playing at the same speed the original tape was recorded on. Ideally and by far the best option is to adjust the pitch of your analog deck right at the stage the tape is being played into the digital recorder.

If this is impractical, digital speed correction is necessary.

Preserving tempo is useful for pitch correction of a single wrong note (on a discrete track).

Preserving pitch is useful for a television documentary where you want to adjust spoken passages to the exact right lengths to sync with the timing of the film. In this case you want the pich of the announcer's voice to stay the same and the tempo (and therefore length of time) will be stretched or squashed.

Since we want to simulate the analog deck running at a different speed, we don't want to preserve pitch or tempo.

The really big complication comes if an analog deck runs at varying speeds during recording or playback. Now that's a challenge to fix!
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  #22  
Old 2005-02-18, 04:59 PM
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starman714 starman714 is offline
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Re: A question about speed correction of lossless files

Ha Ha , looks to me you don't need my help !
You know way more than I could tell you.
I knew about speed changing pitch way back when I'd have to adjust my turntable to play along with a record , since I was tuned correctly but the record was usually too fast , and I see how it applies to tape , but all that other stuff....
I can understand your meaning but I don't really 'know' all that. I know Clapton did some of that on the Let It Rain solo in the studio , which was a big disappointment to me , to read him say they sped it up and synced it with the backing track before they layered it in to the final mix , but as far as foobar shortening a wav and then being able to sync that with a vid , I really don't know , would their read-outs even be the same even though digital is supposed to be mathematically perfect ? Are most softwares on the same page with that ?
You'd know better than I would ,
but thanks for the fascinating conversation , anyway , and wish I was up to speed enough to help with something like that.
I'll just sit back and listen for awhile ! Have a good one , Five
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"We all got it coming, kid." ~ William Munny

suicide nazi gunslinger blazin' down the hall tonight ~ PJ Stevey

in your pomp and all your glory, you're a poorer man than me, as you lick the boots of death born out of fear ~ Ian Anderson

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Originally Posted by general eclectic View Post
Because we can't get by without [you].
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