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Lossy or Lossless? Please use this forum to post spectral and frequency analysis posts about shows you have your doubts about.

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  #1  
Old 2005-06-01, 08:34 PM
rabble
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Devendra Banhart - Live @ KCRW; Lossy Source? (Freq. screencap inside)

So, got this Devendra Banhart @ KCRW's "Morning Becomes Eclectic" in a postal trade the other day, and since it had quite a large ? in the lineage (Studio > FM Broadcast > ? > FLAC), I decided I'd try my first frequency analysis to see if it was lossy source (being that the webcast is the usual source for KCRW's without complete lineage) Soon discoverd that FM broadcasts and mp3 sources have a tendency to look similar in a freq.anal., so I thought I'd run it by the collective intelligence of TTD. So, is this lossy or not? The neat "haircut" right at 16K makes me tend to believe that it is, but I'm hoping against hope that's the FM compression.

Thanks!
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  #2  
Old 2005-06-01, 09:21 PM
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Re: Devendra Banhart - Live @ KCRW; Lossy Source? (Freq. screencap inside)

whats up rabble

i'd say the 16k line is more typical of FM than it is webcast...most of the webcast-captured stuff i've run across cuts out around 18k...

Five can tell ya more...you shuld check the new Spotting Lossy sources forum:
http://www.thetradersden.org/forums/...splay.php?f=47

i'll get one of the mods to move this over there...you should get more replies that way
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  #3  
Old 2005-06-01, 09:32 PM
rabble
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Re: Devendra Banhart - Live @ KCRW; Lossy Source? (Freq. screencap inside)

Awesome, thanks alot, g.

Look forward to that trade we've got coming up!
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  #4  
Old 2005-06-01, 11:20 PM
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Re: Devendra Banhart - Live @ KCRW; Lossy Source? (Freq. screencap inside)

done
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  #5  
Old 2005-06-02, 03:02 AM
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Re: Devendra Banhart - Live @ KCRW; Lossy Source? (Freq. screencap inside)

hey rabble

from what I can see so far it could go either way

if you could post a SA of a full song and another zoomed on about 2 seconds that would be great. and FA too if possible.

good if you can keep the little time numbers at the bottom, too.
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  #6  
Old 2005-06-02, 02:16 PM
rabble
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Re: Devendra Banhart - Live @ KCRW; Lossy Source? (Freq. screencap inside)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Five
hey rabble

from what I can see so far it could go either way

if you could post a SA of a full song and another zoomed on about 2 seconds that would be great. and FA too if possible.

good if you can keep the little time numbers at the bottom, too.
Will do, I'll post as soon as I make it back home.. Thanks again, Five..
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  #7  
Old 2005-06-03, 01:54 PM
rabble
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Re: Devendra Banhart - Live @ KCRW; Lossy Source? (Freq. screencap inside)

Ok, attached are a spectral analysis of the full song, spectral analysis zoomed in 2 sec, and a frequency analysis.

Thanks again for the help, ya'll!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg devban_fa.jpg
( 224.8 KB, 20 views)
 
File Type: jpg devbansa_full.jpg
( 552.2 KB, 20 views)
 
File Type: jpg devbansa_2sec.jpg
( 536.0 KB, 30 views)
 
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  #8  
Old 2005-06-03, 02:24 PM
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Re: Devendra Banhart - Live @ KCRW; Lossy Source? (Freq. screencap inside)

yeah, I'd call that mp3.

the FA isn't displaying correctly. CEP has a bug where you have to move the cursor to sort of wake up the Frequency Analysis display. try opening the file again, opening the FA window then clicking around the cursor on the wave display a few times. It would be cool if you could post a pic of that.
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  #9  
Old 2005-06-03, 03:15 PM
rabble
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Re: Devendra Banhart - Live @ KCRW; Lossy Source? (Freq. screencap inside)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Five
yeah, I'd call that mp3.

the FA isn't displaying correctly. CEP has a bug where you have to move the cursor to sort of wake up the Frequency Analysis display. try opening the file again, opening the FA window then clicking around the cursor on the wave display a few times. It would be cool if you could post a pic of that.
Argh.. That's not what I wanted to hear......

I couldn't get it to change the display by clicking around, but I did adjust HOW it was displaying, maybe this is what you were talking about. I've got both linear and non-linear views attached...

Gimme some good news, five!!
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File Type: jpg fa_linear.jpg
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File Type: jpg fa_nonlinear.jpg
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  #10  
Old 2005-06-03, 05:32 PM
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Re: Devendra Banhart - Live @ KCRW; Lossy Source? (Freq. screencap inside)

Could you please do another sa shot of two seconds and save it in *.gif format? this would be more detailed.

Is this an accoustical track. Does the artist speak much? I donīt know Devendra Banhart.
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  #11  
Old 2005-06-03, 05:41 PM
rabble
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Re: Devendra Banhart - Live @ KCRW; Lossy Source? (Freq. screencap inside)

Quote:
Originally Posted by range_hood
Could you please do another sa shot of two seconds and save it in *.gif format? this would be more detailed.

Is this an accoustical track. Does the artist speak much? I donīt know Devendra Banhart.
It's acoustic, I can post an mp3 sample if it would help. He has a VERY strange voice, too, if it matters any. It'll take me a few minutes to get another SA worked up, I'll post in a few.
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  #12  
Old 2005-06-03, 05:45 PM
rabble
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Re: Devendra Banhart - Live @ KCRW; Lossy Source? (Freq. screencap inside)

Actually, there's no need for me to post a sound sample, you can listen to a webcast of this show here:

http://www.kcrw.com/cgi-bin/db/kcrw....mplt_type=show

The SA & FAs that I have posted are from track 3.
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  #13  
Old 2005-06-03, 10:38 PM
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Re: Devendra Banhart - Live @ KCRW; Lossy Source? (Freq. screencap inside)

I believe the show in question in mp3-sourced. when you get a chance perhaps you could post another FA, you have to click around to sort of wake it up. The one above doesn't look accurate to the SA.
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  #14  
Old 2005-06-03, 11:14 PM
rabble
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Re: Devendra Banhart - Live @ KCRW; Lossy Source? (Freq. screencap inside)

Quote:
Originally Posted by range_hood
Could you please do another sa shot of two seconds and save it in *.gif format? this would be more detailed.

Is this an accoustical track. Does the artist speak much? I donīt know Devendra Banhart.
Gif 2Sec SA Attached, this one of a different part of the song that had a bit more variance:
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  #15  
Old 2005-06-03, 11:16 PM
rabble
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Re: Devendra Banhart - Live @ KCRW; Lossy Source? (Freq. screencap inside)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Five
I believe the show in question in mp3-sourced. when you get a chance perhaps you could post another FA, you have to click around to sort of wake it up. The one above doesn't look accurate to the SA.
And for Five:

(I clicked around like a bastard on this thing, couldn't get it to change a bit. I did, however, uncheck "Linear View", I hope that was what you were looking for.)

Thanks again for the help, guys!
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File Type: gif fa_nonlinear.gif
( 39.1 KB, 124 views)
 
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