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View Poll Results: Do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?
Yes 13 43.33%
No 17 56.67%
Voters: 30. You may not vote on this poll

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  #31  
Old 2009-09-23, 01:20 PM
Kung Poo
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Re: do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?

Quote:
Originally Posted by freezer View Post
And some titles are just copies of older boots with a new set of problems and issues tacked on.
That is so true.
And some of these "remasters" are actually re-works of the newer boots with the newer problems tacked on.
i can think of one in particular where the guy responsible for the "remaster" says in his notes that "there is some digital noise on track 5 that appears to have been added during the transfer from analog to digital, it could not have been present on the analog master reel because it is a uniquely digital type of noise"....
why circulate a remaster of a silver CD that has been shown to have digital errors on it?? the community should have worked to suppress the version with digital errors and get the source back into circulation, rather than a re-work of the error-ridden CD with a new improved EQ setting.
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  #32  
Old 2009-09-28, 09:22 AM
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Re: do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?

This really is a pointless and redundant argument. People keep claiming "preserve the raw original recordings". These are bootlegs. Unless there is 100% confirmation that the recording is direct from a master source, you will NEVER get the raw original recording. Furthermore, even if a recording did come direct from the master source, whos to say that the person who transferred it did so adequately and without significant alteration to the original recording? Most bootlegs, YES EVEN ON THIS SITE THAT APPARENTLY PRESERVES MASTER RECORDINGS, have been "tinkered" with in one way or another, especially silver discs that often don't even have the correct pitch!
And don't even talk about audience recordings taken from some cassette tape. If it isn't from the original master, it has been "tinkered" with greatly, either through editing or simple degradation from high generation tape transfers. If someone can take a dirty sounding tape transfer and make it sound better, it shouldn't be considered musical sacrilege. 99.9% of the time, an audience recording once it gets to flac or shn format on this site or any others has already changed dramatically from it's original form.

It's sad to see immature and uneducated comments of a personal nature where the only arguments should be based on audio fidelity and edited techniques. Such people are the real polluters and do nothing but taint this forum with negativity and a teenage mentality. Even if I or anyone else who uploads a remastered recording does a horrible job, there is nowhere that says you have to download it. It's too bad this is being made an issue. There are a lot of other things that should be addressed that are "actual" problems.
Thanks to those who are rational and attempt to actually discuss things without resorting to childish attacks. Just for the record, here are some of the enlightened messages Dana Gillespie has been sending my way:

"and by the way, you are very easily taken in, and you reveal far to much about yourself. I'm guessing the Parson's Nose was your mother's favourite part of the turkey she married? is that right?"

"A REAL MAN WOULD NEVER HAVE REACTED AT ALL (can you understand that? testosterone kicks in and the shit you don't want to hear just goes over your head). come out to L.A., i'll introduce you to some of the quietest men you ever met: all of them quiet because they have nothing to prove, but they'd cut your throat without blinking if you asked for it.
maybe you'll understand that one day, little boy.
i ain't the first person on this site to note that you take things very personally; i won't be the last.
sad for you that you let a frigging woman upset you.
sad piece of dog shit. "

"oh yeah, i forget, you're SO intellectual... you sad fucking idiot; you miss half of the comments made to you because you're so fucking dumb. you are very sad, trying to boost your ego by playing around with other people's music... why don't you make some music of your own??? oh... i guess you can't.
dumb mother-fucker.... if it wasn't so obvious that you live at home with your mother, i'd guess that she was dead and that you were fucking her corpse on a daily basis.
if you had balls, you wouldn't react to criticism.... you fucking moron. "

"Oh dear... you sad, pathetic little child.
grow some balls."

And this is all because of my attempt to defend a remastered recording I uploaded. Such people are a real scourge and make no attempt to back up their criticism with actual facts or points. According to Dana, I need to grow some balls and be a real man because of my desire to defend my work.
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  #33  
Old 2009-09-28, 12:33 PM
Dana Gillespie
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Re: do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?

Quote:
Originally Posted by theface07 View Post
I need to grow some balls and be a real man because of my desire to defend my work.
Work?
Gee, you sure sound egocentric when you put it like that.
re: the quotes that you posted....
but, hey, wait a minute, FACE07... you only posted the things that I said...... are you painting a fair and balanced picture of this conversation??? i mean, a really fair picture???

anyone can check The Who, Munich '72 thread. anyone can see how it happened: i say "you've reduced the bass", then you say "I'm personally offended", then i ask "do you remaster for your ego", then you say "don't get personal!!!!"

but, FACE07, you took it personal way back when it was just a little criticism of the "remaster"...... you need a little more confidence in your work.

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  #34  
Old 2009-09-29, 01:15 PM
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Re: do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DanielG View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by theface07 View Post
Some people say there's a difference between the decompressed FLAC>wav but I haven't detected it.
Some people have no idea what they're talking about.
its elementary to prove/disprove whether a fileset is identical or not. seriously.
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  #35  
Old 2009-09-29, 05:27 PM
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rspencer rspencer is offline
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Re: do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?

Quote:
Originally Posted by theface07 View Post
This really is a pointless and redundant argument. People keep claiming "preserve the raw original recordings". These are bootlegs. Unless there is 100% confirmation that the recording is direct from a master source, you will NEVER get the raw original recording.
Thus making any alteration merely that, not remastering. It can be EQed, normalized, pitch-corrected, sped up or slowed down, but without using the master, it is not remastering.
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Sometimes im dense.
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I hate not being a real man.
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  #36  
Old 2009-09-29, 11:10 PM
jfaninord jfaninord is offline
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Re: do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?

I've not missed the point at all. Pay no attention to these attention-seeking folk? That is my solution.

The point is where would one draw the line? Does only the taper (or perhaps initial seeder? someone in between?) have the right to tweak the recording for it to be ttd-appropriate? I don't expect all tapers to be experienced with editing and mastering -- some people just aren't as interested in that stuff. Sure, some (a lot) of what people do with remasters is subjective but not all of it.

Much better solution would be to add some requirement for documenting what exactly was done in the remaster work, maybe require both before and after samples so we don't have to download completely blindly, form a safe list etc. It doesn't make sense to me for the site not to allow an improved recording to be posted.

What if a taper forgets/loses his mics but another taper shares his signal so that they end up with identical recordings, then each goes home and masters their own copy with differing results? Is one more suitable for circulation than the other? And is a 44.1kHz/16bit version of a recording allowed after the 96kHz/24bit version has already been seeded? You have to place rules and rationalize all of these possibilities -- it's not as simple as, say, minidisc masters.



Quote:
Originally Posted by schmoe75 View Post
You're missing the point. It's one thing for the taper to tweak their recording VS some attention seeking, clueless leech, eq'n it and seeding it as a Remaster OR some bullshit company tweak'n and selling it as a Silver.

There will always be a swath of the population who will buy Silvers because they don't know about torrent sites and it comes with fancy packaging/artwork, but these are the same people who don't understand what's wrong with mp3.

What leechs do with something once they get it can't be controlled, but when a taper shares their Master recording, there's zero reason to allow Un-Authorized Remasters to pollute the pool.
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  #37  
Old 2009-09-30, 01:47 AM
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Re: do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jfaninord View Post
...Much better solution would be to add some requirement for documenting what exactly was done in ....
OK, that would just about exclude almost all "silver" bootlegs, right? You AIN'T getting much documentation on ANY 'silvers', hmmmm?

WHO knows what 'tweaking' is done by the bootleg 'labels' in addition to not knowing any other lineage on them there 'silvers'....

Hell, there's some "remaster-ers" out there that specialize in using unknown gen recordings and then "tweaking" the lineage also.... oops, sorry, "tweaking lineage"...sorry, I meant to say that they call it "speculating on the lineage" or "guesstimating the lineage"

and you can find some of these in the ABT forum here and now.

oh well.....
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  #38  
Old 2009-09-30, 07:18 AM
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AAR.oner AAR.oner is offline
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Re: do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jfaninord View Post

form a safe list etc. It doesn't make sense to me for the site not to allow an improved recording to be posted.
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  #39  
Old 2009-09-30, 08:33 AM
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Re: do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?

So who's to say which recording has been "improved" by 'tweaking',

especially IF the unblemished recording IS NOT used for said 'tweaking'???
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  #40  
Old 2009-09-30, 08:49 AM
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AAR.oner AAR.oner is offline
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Re: do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?

staff

and if people don't like it, tough shit...d/l from another site
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  #41  
Old 2009-09-30, 06:00 PM
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Re: do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AAR.oner View Post
staff

and if people don't like it, tough shit...d/l from another site


By the way, what if the original taper doesn't like the "remaster" ???

Still going to allow it at TTD and stick it to the taper?

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You wall-eyed apple-knocking pig-fuckers! You don't know shit!
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  #42  
Old 2009-09-30, 07:00 PM
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Re: do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?

technically, it could happen, but we would do our utmost to prevent this, communicate with everybody involved.
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  #43  
Old 2009-09-30, 07:00 PM
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pmonk pmonk is offline
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Re: do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?

I think zep phan does a real good job - so his stuff should be board approved!
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  #44  
Old 2009-09-30, 07:03 PM
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Re: do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?

yeah, that's pretty much a given
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  #45  
Old 2009-09-30, 07:50 PM
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Re: do remasters fit with the site's mission statement?

Quote:
Originally Posted by freezer View Post
By the way, what if the original taper doesn't like the "remaster" ???

Still going to allow it at TTD and stick it to the taper?

We don't pull shows at the tapers request. If the taper doesn't want his show messed with, he shouldn't circulate it. And I'm not going to try to police and figure out which taper is real or not. This is the internet. How the hell do I know who is who?
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