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  #1  
Old 2007-03-01, 02:54 PM
showtaper's Avatar
showtaper showtaper is offline
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Arrow Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

Reason given for removal:

9. Only DVDs produced as DVDs may be seeded here.
No DVDs will be allowed to be seeded here with conversions from lesser quality video (ie. VCD/SVCD/DivX/xvid/etc converted to DVD). Converting a lesser quality video to DVD does not make the quality of the video any better, and is therefore pointless. It is equivilent to creating a flac fileset from mp3s simply because the flac format came around and is better than all others. None of the above mentioned video codecs are up to par with The Trader's Den Video BT Seeding Guidelines, and therefore, will not be allowed on the tracker.

Please read the following concerning VALID DVD video formats:

The typical video resolution for an NTSC disc is 720 480, while a PAL disc is 720 576. The specifications for video files on a DVD can be any of the following:

Up to 9.8 Mbit/s (9800 kbit/s) MPEG-2 video
Up to 1.856 Mbit/s (1856 kbit/s) MPEG-1 video
PAL:
720 576 pixels MPEG-2 (Called full D1)
704 576 pixels MPEG-2
352 576 pixels MPEG-2 (Called Half-D1, same as the China Video Disc standard)
352 288 pixels MPEG-2
352 288 pixels MPEG-1 (Same as the VCD Standard)
NTSC:
720 480 pixels MPEG-2 (Called full D1)
704 480 pixels MPEG-2
352 480 pixels MPEG-2 (Called Half-D1, same as the China Video Disc standard)
352 240 pixels MPEG-2
352 240 pixels MPEG-1 (Same as the VCD Standard)

The file in the torrent was listed as MPEG-1 352 x 240 and is therefore
DVD compliant. The poster even mentioned that he did not re-encode.
The video is not "converted" to make a DVD, it is valid as is. Your "rule"
is not even technically correct.

The REAL REASON that this should be banned is that a major portion of this
broadcast has been officially released.
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  #2  
Old 2007-03-01, 03:54 PM
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KoolKat KoolKat is offline
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Re: Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

How did you work out that mpeg 1 is DvD compliant.
Read what you wrote chap

The file in the torrent was listed as MPEG-1 352 x 240
and you've already said
352 240 pixels MPEG-1 (Same as the VCD Standard)

basically it was an authored VCD that WILL play in a DvD player as a DvD ,dont get me wrong,but only because of the 352 as THAT is DvD compliant.Half of 704 which is a cropped DvD Standard as well

But the torrent was still mpeg 1 which is NOT a DvD standard its a VCD standard.

With me

So it would be pulled...but definatly now that you add the extra info with it being official whether it was DvD,VCD or even a cup of Brooke Bond D Tea

K_K
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  #3  
Old 2007-03-01, 07:44 PM
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Re: Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

http://www.thetradersden.org/forums/...ad.php?t=34879
An officially released VCD, even better

9. Only DVDs produced as DVDs may be seeded here.
No DVDs will be allowed to be seeded here with conversions from lesser quality video (ie. VCD/SVCD/DivX/xvid/etc converted to DVD).

mpeg1 = VCD (whether its put on a dvd or not, its still a lossy compressed piece of shit VCD)

So the reason it was pulled is valid ....the fact its an OR (which was not known until this thread) only provides a 2nd reason.


THANX KK

Quote:
Originally Posted by showtaper
Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

Reason given for removal:

9. Only DVDs produced as DVDs may be seeded here.
No DVDs will be allowed to be seeded here with conversions from lesser quality video (ie. VCD/SVCD/DivX/xvid/etc converted to DVD). Converting a lesser quality video to DVD does not make the quality of the video any better, and is therefore pointless. It is equivilent to creating a flac fileset from mp3s simply because the flac format came around and is better than all others. None of the above mentioned video codecs are up to par with The Trader's Den Video BT Seeding Guidelines, and therefore, will not be allowed on the tracker.

Please read the following concerning VALID DVD video formats:

The typical video resolution for an NTSC disc is 720 480, while a PAL disc is 720 576. The specifications for video files on a DVD can be any of the following:

Up to 9.8 Mbit/s (9800 kbit/s) MPEG-2 video
Up to 1.856 Mbit/s (1856 kbit/s) MPEG-1 video
PAL:
720 576 pixels MPEG-2 (Called full D1)
704 576 pixels MPEG-2
352 576 pixels MPEG-2 (Called Half-D1, same as the China Video Disc standard)
352 288 pixels MPEG-2
352 288 pixels MPEG-1 (Same as the VCD Standard)
NTSC:
720 480 pixels MPEG-2 (Called full D1)
704 480 pixels MPEG-2
352 480 pixels MPEG-2 (Called Half-D1, same as the China Video Disc standard)
352 240 pixels MPEG-2
352 240 pixels MPEG-1 (Same as the VCD Standard)

The file in the torrent was listed as MPEG-1 352 x 240 and is therefore
DVD compliant. The poster even mentioned that he did not re-encode.
The video is not "converted" to make a DVD, it is valid as is. Your "rule"
is not even technically correct.

The REAL REASON that this should be banned is that a major portion of this
broadcast has been officially released.
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  #4  
Old 2007-03-01, 10:58 PM
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showtaper showtaper is offline
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Re: Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

Quote:
Originally Posted by KoolKat
How did you work out that mpeg 1 is DvD compliant.
Read what you wrote chap

The file in the torrent was listed as MPEG-1 352 x 240
and you've already said
352 240 pixels MPEG-1 (Same as the VCD Standard)

basically it was an authored VCD that WILL play in a DvD player as a DvD ,dont get me wrong,but only because of the 352 as THAT is DvD compliant.Half of 704 which is a cropped DvD Standard as well

But the torrent was still mpeg 1 which is NOT a DvD standard its a VCD standard.

With me

So it would be pulled...but definatly now that you add the extra info with it being official whether it was DvD,VCD or even a cup of Brooke Bond D Tea

K_K
352 240 pixels MPEG-1 (Same as the VCD Standard) is DVD compliant.
Please spend two seconds and look up the specification. All the formats
listed in my previous post are DVD COMPLIANT.

Whether or not it looks like shit is a completely different issue.

I couldn't look at the posters files as the thread is locked. Try reading
his comments, he took a DVD compliant MPEG-1 file and AUTHORED
a DVD from it. Read what someone else wrote, chap.

Personally, I have a line feed recording of this broadcast (provided by a
friend at Chrysalis records) which includes footage not broadcast, so I'm
not really interested in this torrent, just the bogus reason for its removal.

BTW - this was never released as an official VCD. Portions have been
included on official videocassette and DVD. You don't need anything more
than a quick google to figure this out.........
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  #5  
Old 2007-03-01, 11:04 PM
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gsmyth79 gsmyth79 is offline
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Re: Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

Quote:
Originally Posted by showtaper
352 240 pixels MPEG-1 (Same as the VCD Standard) is DVD compliant.
Please spend two seconds and look up the specification. All the formats
listed in my previous post are DVD COMPLIANT.
Please reread this:
9. Only DVDs produced as DVDs may be seeded here.
No DVDs will be allowed to be seeded here with conversions from lesser quality video (ie. VCD/SVCD/DivX/xvid/etc converted to DVD).

This is TTD's policy because a VCD is the video equivalent of mp3. We are trying to maintain standards here, it does not matter that it is DVD compliant. Many CD players can now play mp3s but we still don't allow them here. Same thing for VCDs. Not sure how much clearer this can be.

You may think these standards are arbitrary and wrong but they are there for a reason. If you have a problem with that then take your torrent over to thepiratebay or something.
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  #6  
Old 2007-03-01, 11:38 PM
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showtaper showtaper is offline
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Re: Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

Quote:
Originally Posted by gsmyth79
Please reread this:
9. Only DVDs produced as DVDs may be seeded here.
No DVDs will be allowed to be seeded here with conversions from lesser quality video (ie. VCD/SVCD/DivX/xvid/etc converted to DVD).

This is TTD's policy because a VCD is the video equivalent of mp3. We are trying to maintain standards here, it does not matter that it is DVD compliant. Many CD players can now play mp3s but we still don't allow them here. Same thing for VCDs. Not sure how much clearer this can be.

You may think these standards are arbitrary and wrong but they are there for a reason. If you have a problem with that then take your torrent over to thepiratebay or something.
Not my torrent. Doesn't anyone here have the ability to construct a valid
thought? A DVD produced from any compliant file IS A FUCKING DVD.
Any MPEG video is lossy and would qualify as the "equivalent of mp3".

What I have a problem with is the wording of your rule. The torrent as
uploaded was produced as a DVD. Change your wording to read:

"Only DVDs produced from MPEG-2 files will be allowed here."

But wait! What about these other evil DVD compliant files???

NTSC:
352 480 pixels MPEG-2 (Called Half-D1, same as the China Video Disc standard)
352 240 pixels MPEG-2

Your rule is arbitrary. Period.

Take your attitude over to www.gofuckyourself.com. Not sure how much clearer this can be.
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  #7  
Old 2007-03-02, 04:58 AM
KoolKat's Avatar
KoolKat KoolKat is offline
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Re: Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

Calm down showtaper

DvD stands for Digital VERSATILE Disc ok ,meaning that it able to do or be used for many things.But it must be "compliant" for it to play.

So yes,a VCD is DvD compliant meaning only that it will play if you put it on a "DvD" disc....but a VCD is NOT DvD standard.
Best scenario is that if no re-encoding took place,then it was recorded as a Mpeg 1 VCD ,that is DvD compliant...NOT a DvD mpeg2 "STANDARD"

compliant vs standard is your point that you are questioning and at TTD we only accept STANDARD

Getting it yet??

K_K

So your www.gofuckyourself comment to a mod is not really correct either.

Try looking at www.imustlearnwhatiknowfuckallabout.com

Last edited by KoolKat; 2007-03-02 at 05:04 AM.
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  #8  
Old 2007-03-02, 07:05 AM
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Re: Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

simple as this showtaper, the show yer talking about is below our standards...whether or not it is compliant in regards to playability makes no difference...despite the fact that all these formats you keep bringing up are "compliant", they are NOT the standard...honestly, i would guess less than 1% of all professional DVDs produced last year were sourced from footage with one of those specs [and thats probly generous]...

as for our rules, we don't say anything re: any file that's compliant, we specify none that are from VCD/SVCD/DivX etc spec'd material, which this show is from

yes, all DVDs are lossy, which is why we only allow "the best" in regards to the MPEG codec suite [and you know which that is]...fact of the matter, a 352x240 MPEG1 is not going to have near the quality as a 720x480 MPEG2...you can argue all you want, but that is the simple truth

whether or not you don't like the wording, sure maybe we could change it...but up to this point, everyone has understood what we meant by that rule...and so do you, i have a feeling...but i'm sure we could edit it
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  #9  
Old 2007-03-02, 07:55 AM
schmoe75's Avatar
schmoe75 schmoe75 is offline
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Re: Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

I dont know where he got "The file in the torrent was listed as MPEG-1 352 x 240 and is therefore DVD compliant. "...maybe I'm missing something but "DVD Compliant" is not listed anywhere in the rule.

Quote:
Originally Posted by showtaper
A DVD produced from any compliant file IS A FUCKING DVD.
NO its FUCKING NOT...its still a VCD dumbass (a VCD authored and recorded onto a DVD is NOT a DVD....its nothing more than a VCD recorded onto a DVD)

Quote:
Originally Posted by showtaper
Doesn't anyone here have the ability to construct a valid
thought? Take your attitude....Not sure how much clearer this can be.

thats actually funny considering you're the one who stated this thread with an attitude.

Quote:
Originally Posted by showtaper
Any MPEG video is lossy and would qualify as the "equivalent of mp3".
believe it or not with your vast array of knowledge, transferring, and authoring skills...we the staff actually know that MPEG2 is a compressed lossy source, but considering its not feasible at this point technology wise to record a 20 gig LOSSLESS AVI file onto a disc and/or distribute it on the net...MPEG2 is the BEST, HIGHEST QUALITY source.
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  #10  
Old 2007-03-02, 07:59 AM
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showtaper showtaper is offline
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Re: Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

Quote:
Originally Posted by AAR.oner
simple as this showtaper, the show yer talking about is below our standards...whether or not it is compliant in regards to playability makes no difference...despite the fact that all these formats you keep bringing up are "compliant", they are NOT the standard...honestly, i would guess less than 1% of all professional DVDs produced last year were sourced from footage with one of those specs [and thats probly generous]...

as for our rules, we don't say anything re: any file that's compliant, we specify none that are from VCD/SVCD/DivX etc spec'd material, which this show is from

yes, all DVDs are lossy, which is why we only allow "the best" in regards to the MPEG codec suite [and you know which that is]...fact of the matter, a 352x240 MPEG1 is not going to have near the quality as a 720x480 MPEG2...you can argue all you want, but that is the simple truth

whether or not you don't like the wording, sure maybe we could change it...but up to this point, everyone has understood what we meant by that rule...and so do you, i have a feeling...but i'm sure we could edit it
Actually, when I'm in a shit mood, I just like to fuck with people.

Just keep those 23rd generation VHS transfers coming folks, as long as
they are Traders Den compliant, they are "the best".....
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  #11  
Old 2007-03-02, 08:08 AM
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schmoe75 schmoe75 is offline
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Re: Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

Quote:
Originally Posted by showtaper
Just keep those 23rd generation VHS transfers coming folks, as long as
they are Traders Den compliant, they are "the best".....
There you go again w/ "compliant"...where exactly is compliant mentioned in the rule again?

In the end, everything comes down to the discretion of the staff. If you dont like it, no one is forcing you to stay ....feel free to visit www.gofuckyourself.com ...i hear they have tons of 23rd Gen VCD's.

You're the only person in the 2+ yrs of the site who hasnt gotten this...
No DVDs will be allowed to be seeded here with conversions from lesser quality video (ie. VCD/SVCD/DivX/xvid/etc converted to DVD).

mpeg1 is a VCD
What part of this do you NOT get exactly?
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  #12  
Old 2007-03-02, 10:41 AM
KoolKat's Avatar
KoolKat KoolKat is offline
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Re: Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

Here you go schmoe...borrow this m8
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  #13  
Old 2007-03-02, 11:07 PM
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Re: Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

Thank you sir
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  #14  
Old 2007-03-02, 11:41 PM
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showtaper showtaper is offline
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Re: Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

Quote:
Originally Posted by schmoe75
There you go again w/ "compliant"...where exactly is compliant mentioned in the rule again?

In the end, everything comes down to the discretion of the staff. If you dont like it, no one is forcing you to stay ....feel free to visit www.gofuckyourself.com ...i hear they have tons of 23rd Gen VCD's.

You're the only person in the 2+ yrs of the site who hasnt gotten this...
No DVDs will be allowed to be seeded here with conversions from lesser quality video (ie. VCD/SVCD/DivX/xvid/etc converted to DVD).

mpeg1 is a VCD
What part of this do you NOT get exactly?
That you're fun, for an idiot.

I was just pointing out that your rule is self-contradictory and should
be revised to accurately reflect the requirements.

Never said I didn't like it, never said I didn't understand it. I said it was
wrong and it still is. Want me to explain what is contradictory about
your rule one more time?? Or don't you understand??
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  #15  
Old 2007-03-03, 12:11 AM
schmoe75's Avatar
schmoe75 schmoe75 is offline
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Re: Banned for the wrong reason: JETHRO TULL 1978-10-09 Madison Square Garden, NYC (NTSC)

Quote:
Originally Posted by showtaper
That you're fun, for an idiot.

I was just pointing out that your rule is self-contradictory and should
be revised to accurately reflect the requirements.

Never said I didn't like it, never said I didn't understand it. I said it was
wrong and it still is. Want me to explain what is contradictory about
your rule one more time?? Or don't you understand??
One more time?...what you've explained so far is your obvious ignorance as to what an MPEG-1 is.

So, if I compile a bunch of mp3's and put them on a dvd...i guess it makes that a DVD as well since it's "DVD compliant", so we should allow that?

http://www.thetradersden.org/forums/...faq_videorules
9. Only DVDs produced from MPEG-2 may be seeded here.
No DVDs will be allowed to be seeded here which were sourced from lesser quality video (ie. VCD/SVCD/DivX/xvid/etc converted to DVD).

Edited...happy now?
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