The Traders' Den  

  The Traders' Den > Where we go to learn ..... > Technobabble
 

Notices

Technobabble Post your general Need for Help questions here.
Lossy or Lossless?
Moderators

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 2005-01-19, 11:54 PM
irishcrazy2005's Avatar
irishcrazy2005 irishcrazy2005 is offline
Yeah, that's a zebra donkey
110.97 GB/130.20 GB/1.17
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Berkeley, CA
Fixing SBEs with shntool

Okay guys, I am a newbie at working with shntool and checking for/fixing SBEs. I ran the -len command on the folder, and it shows a -b- in the CDR column for the last track. When I try to fix it with the -fix command, it tells me "error: need two or more files to process." Is it normal to have a -b- in last track? How do I fix it if it is not? Thanks for the help.

-Phil
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #2  
Old 2005-01-20, 11:59 AM
RainDawg's Avatar
RainDawg RainDawg is offline
Renegade Geek
10.20 GB/20.72 GB/2.03
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Passing swiftly through The Moor
Re: Fixing SBEs with shntool

shntool will not fix a set of files the only SB that exists is in the last track. Obviously, when burned to a CD, the resultant gap that it will write to the end of this track will not be noticed. Personally, I prefer to fix these because I consider have SBs on a any track to be bad practice. shntool will do with the the pad -postpad command, performed only on the track in question.

I believe there is an option that can be added to the -fix command that will force it to pad the final track if it's the only one containing an SBE, but I use -pad for that so don't know from the top of my head.
__________________
Through the clouds,
Throught the lies,
We'll never see,
What's never been,
At the ending of life and the coming of death,
Pass not through its gates but into the dark.
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #3  
Old 2005-01-20, 02:31 PM
uhclem
0.00 KB/0.00 KB/---
 
Re: Fixing SBEs with shntool

You can tell shntool to fix the entire set and it will fix just the last track. I don't think you need to use the -noskip option but try it if the regular way doesn't work. But if you know it's just the last track I personally prefer the -pad argument as suggested by RainDawg

Q: Why are you concerned with fixing this last track? My view is that if all you are doing is archiving or burning files that you got from someone else just leave the last track as it is. An SBE on the very last track doesn't matter. BUT if you made these files yourself from wav files then it's good practice to get rid of that SBE even on the last track before you spread it around. It saves newbs like yourself the trouble of wondering what to do about it later.
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #4  
Old 2005-01-20, 02:47 PM
irishcrazy2005's Avatar
irishcrazy2005 irishcrazy2005 is offline
Yeah, that's a zebra donkey
110.97 GB/130.20 GB/1.17
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Berkeley, CA
Re: Fixing SBEs with shntool

Quote:
Originally Posted by uhclem
You can tell shntool to fix the entire set and it will fix just the last track. I don't think you need to use the -noskip option but try it if the regular way doesn't work. But if you know it's just the last track I personally prefer the -pad argument as suggested by RainDawg

Q: Why are you concerned with fixing this last track? My view is that if all you are doing is archiving or burning files that you got from someone else just leave the last track as it is. An SBE on the very last track doesn't matter. BUT if you made these files yourself from wav files then it's good practice to get rid of that SBE even on the last track before you spread it around. It saves newbs like yourself the trouble of wondering what to do about it later.
Thanks for the info from both you and RainDawg. Like I said, I have never dealt with SBEs before, so that is why I was concerned about seening one at all. I figured that it didn't matter, but I wanted to be sure. I'm at work right now, but when I get home I will try the -pad command. Thanks again.

-Phil
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #5  
Old 2005-01-20, 04:01 PM
bobs23's Avatar
bobs23 bobs23 is offline
in LA LA land
6.86 GB/47.63 GB/6.94
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Re: Fixing SBEs with shntool

How I have gotten around this is: I use Soundforge to do the processing, and I always add 3 sec of silence at the end. Then track in CDwave. I like to leave 2 sec of silence at the end. so I split 1 sec from the end of the file and then put the whole file to shnfix then delete the last 1 sec track. May not be perfect, but it works.
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #6  
Old 2005-01-20, 04:36 PM
uhclem
0.00 KB/0.00 KB/---
 
Re: Fixing SBEs with shntool

bobs, I don't completely understand your method, and since you are using shntool already you don't need to do it this way, i.e. you don't need to create a 1 sec track at the end.

In -fix mode shntool will automatically pad the last track if it needs it. Just add the 2 sec of silence at the end of the last track the way you like it, then run shntool over each musical set of files in -fix mode and it will fix the last track for you. Shntool takes wildcards, e.g. *.wav

But if you are confident that soundforge is cutting the tracks along sector boundaries and the issue is simply that the last track needs a little padding, then definitely just use -pad mode on the last track. The syntax would be:

Code:
shntool pad -postpad -o wav {filename}
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #7  
Old 2005-01-20, 04:53 PM
New Homebrew
0.00 KB/0.00 KB/---
 
Re: Fixing SBEs with shntool

FLAC frontend will add the necessary samples to the last track if you check "align on sector boundaries".

From CDWave, just save as wav files. Then encode to FLAC using FLAC Frontend with align sector boundaries checked off. That will take care of the last track so you don't have to try to shave it...
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #8  
Old 2005-01-20, 08:37 PM
bobs23's Avatar
bobs23 bobs23 is offline
in LA LA land
6.86 GB/47.63 GB/6.94
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Re: Fixing SBEs with shntool

After a couple of discussions with the soundforge people, you can only get it to mark on the zero cross which is not always the sector boundry. I did some tests and the best I could get was about 60% correct. I put the 2 seconds of silence after the last track mostly for personal preferance, I just don't like having the last track end and the disc just jumps out. When I use shntool without the false ending, it doesn't fix the error on the end of the last track. Some people get tweaked about it. I'm most certainly not saying this method is gospel, it just works for me.
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #9  
Old 2005-01-20, 10:02 PM
uhclem
0.00 KB/0.00 KB/---
 
Re: Fixing SBEs with shntool

If soundforge can't cut along sector boundaries except by accident, I'd definitely use different software for cutting the wave file into tracks, e.g. CDWave.

Shntool can fix the last track even if it's the only track with an SBE. If it's not doing it, then you are probably doing something wrong. What mode and arguments do you use? Maybe if you can provide an example we could help.
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #10  
Old 2005-01-21, 08:03 AM
RainDawg's Avatar
RainDawg RainDawg is offline
Renegade Geek
10.20 GB/20.72 GB/2.03
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Passing swiftly through The Moor
Re: Fixing SBEs with shntool

I agree....if Sound Forge is not reliably cutting on SBs, then just don't use it for that purpose. It sounds like you are performing quite a few more uncomfortable processes than is necessary. If you want to use SoundForge to track, then simply cut it how you want, with the additional silence at the end, and then run -fix on each set, knowing you'll have SBs on the tracks.
__________________
Through the clouds,
Throught the lies,
We'll never see,
What's never been,
At the ending of life and the coming of death,
Pass not through its gates but into the dark.
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #11  
Old 2005-01-21, 08:09 AM
NINJA's Avatar
NINJA NINJA is offline
Banned
795.31 MB/607.86 MB/0.76
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Re: Fixing SBEs with shntool

Quote:
Originally Posted by RainDawg
I agree....if Sound Forge is not reliably cutting on SBs, then just don't use it for that purpose. It sounds like you are performing quite a few more uncomfortable processes than is necessary. If you want to use SoundForge to track, then simply cut it how you want, with the additional silence at the end, and then run -fix on each set, knowing you'll have SBs on the tracks.

I USE CD ARCHITECH FOR TRACKING

MAKE ONE BIG WAV FILE IN SOUND FORGE

LOAD IT CD ARCHITECH TRACK AND BURN WITH CD ARCHITECH AND NO SBE'S

NO NEED TO CUT TRACKS INTO SEPERATE FILES

I CAN NEVER UNDERSTAND WHY SOMEONE WOULD WANT TO HAVE SEPERATE WAV FILES ? ONLY TO REASEMBLE THEM AGAIN TO BURN THE CD ?
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #12  
Old 2005-01-21, 08:11 AM
NINJA's Avatar
NINJA NINJA is offline
Banned
795.31 MB/607.86 MB/0.76
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Re: Fixing SBEs with shntool

Quote:
Originally Posted by RainDawg
I agree....if Sound Forge is not reliably cutting on SBs, then just don't use it for that purpose. It sounds like you are performing quite a few more uncomfortable processes than is necessary. If you want to use SoundForge to track, then simply cut it how you want, with the additional silence at the end, and then run -fix on each set, knowing you'll have SBs on the tracks.

SOUND FORGE IS A EDITING PROGRAM NOT FOR BURNING THATS WHY

IT IS NOT CONCERNED WITH SBE'S


CD ARCHITECH ON THE OTHER HAND IS FOR BURNING AND WILL AUTOMATICALLY CUT AT THE PROPER SECTOR BOUNDRIES

AT LEAST THATS BEEN MY EXPERIANCE
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #13  
Old 2005-01-21, 08:13 AM
NINJA's Avatar
NINJA NINJA is offline
Banned
795.31 MB/607.86 MB/0.76
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Re: Fixing SBEs with shntool

Quote:
Originally Posted by uhclem
If soundforge can't cut along sector boundaries except by accident, I'd definitely use different software for cutting the wave file into tracks, e.g. CDWave.

Shntool can fix the last track even if it's the only track with an SBE. If it's not doing it, then you are probably doing something wrong. What mode and arguments do you use? Maybe if you can provide an example we could help.


ID SAY THAT IF YOU HAVE TO CUT YOUR WAV FILE UP

YOU NEED BETTER CD BURNER SOFTWARE
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #14  
Old 2005-01-21, 08:30 AM
RainDawg's Avatar
RainDawg RainDawg is offline
Renegade Geek
10.20 GB/20.72 GB/2.03
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Passing swiftly through The Moor
Re: Fixing SBEs with shntool

Quote:
Originally Posted by NINJA
I CAN NEVER UNDERSTAND WHY SOMEONE WOULD WANT TO HAVE SEPERATE WAV FILES ? ONLY TO REASEMBLE THEM AGAIN TO BURN THE CD ?
Because many people, myself included, never ever burn to CD. You're assuming that people store their music on CD, but I have not burned an audio CD is almost two years now. FLAC is simply the way go.

It could be argued that since I never even make audio CDs, that worrying about SBs is pointless anyway, but I worry about it only becauce it's bad practice to trade or seed to others files that are misaligned. If I had my way, no one would burn audio discs anymore, we'd all keep things in the much safer FLAC format, and no one would have to even think about all this SBE crap.
__________________
Through the clouds,
Throught the lies,
We'll never see,
What's never been,
At the ending of life and the coming of death,
Pass not through its gates but into the dark.
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
  #15  
Old 2005-01-21, 09:22 AM
bobs23's Avatar
bobs23 bobs23 is offline
in LA LA land
6.86 GB/47.63 GB/6.94
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Re: Fixing SBEs with shntool

I do only use SF for WAV processing. I use CDWave for tracking. I'll give my cmd line syntax when I get home from work. I am assuming that I can add -pad to the end of the -fix cmd. CD arch. is a good program, I had it on trial for a while but I couldn't see paying $100 for it when cdwave is free. The only problem with my method is I end up with a file for the raw wave, processed wave, and the tracked wave.
Reply With Quote Reply with Nested Quotes
Reply

The Traders' Den > Where we go to learn ..... > Technobabble

Similar Threads
Thread Forum Replies Last Post
fixing disks with gaps - bataclan2002 Technobabble 8 2007-08-16 12:15 PM
Need help fixing & enhancing show! - bubble97 Technobabble 0 2006-06-25 09:49 AM
TLH SBE Fixing... - jcrab66 Technobabble 13 2006-02-13 08:08 AM
fixing sbe's - pernod Technobabble 1 2005-05-25 12:53 PM
Fixing an audio disc with SBEs - PsychoPsonic Technobabble 3 2005-02-05 06:50 PM


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forums


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:37 AM.


Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - , TheTradersDen.org - All Rights Reserved - Hosted at QuickPacket
no new posts