Recording XM

[wharfrat73]

I was wondering if there is a site policy regarding the recording of XM broadcasts. XM is a lossy source. By the same measurements, so is FM. Are XM and FM both banned or neither?

[fatoldpig]

I'd like to know too. I recorded bunch of stuff too. I've connected XM line out (analog) to line in of sound card Midiman Audiophile 2496 and recording with CEP.

[Rider]

XM is not allowed here.

[wharfrat73]

Is FM?

[Five]

Originally Posted by wharfrat73

Is FM?

Yes

[wharfrat73]

How is it that FM is allowed and XM is not? ...just curious

[Five]

FM (so long as it's not from a lossy source) is allowed. Even tho frequency response isn't perfect, it is free from audible artifacts associated with lossy encoding. Similar situation with 32K DAT. The freqency response is similar to some lossy formats but the offensive swish et al are not present.

[oldbrokentapes]

Can I be so ignorant as to ask what XM is? Possibly digital radio a la DAB and DVB?

[Jackstraw_1969]

Originally Posted by Five

Even tho frequency response isn't perfect, it is free from audible artifacts associated with lossy encoding.

This is not necessarily the case these days.

Stations compress their audio in many ways, and in most cases you have different compression "stacked" upon one another. Although MPEG2 has been the standard for 20 years in satellite delivery to the stations, I know of many stations that play MP3. Even if a station is playing CD's (44.1, no compression) it will get stepped on going to the transmitter.You don't even want to think about today's new HD radio!

To allow FM, and not XM or Sirrus seems like a double standard if you use the "compression" argument. Now what comes over the airwaves is "free", and XM and Sirrus are "services" so legally you may have to keep them off here anyway.

[Jackstraw_1969]

Originally Posted by robkismet

Can I be so ignorant as to ask what XM is? Possibly digital radio a la DAB and DVB?

Satellite Radio

[Five]

Originally Posted by Jackstraw_1969

This is not necessarily the case these days.

Stations compress their audio in many ways, and in most cases you have different compression "stacked" upon one another. Although MPEG2 has been the standard for 20 years in satellite delivery to the stations, I know of many stations that play MP3. Even if a station is playing CD's (44.1, no compression) it will get stepped on going to the transmitter.You don't even want to think about today's new HD radio!

To allow FM, and not XM or Sirrus seems like a double standard if you use the "compression" argument. Now what comes over the airwaves is "free", and XM and Sirrus are "services" so legally you may have to keep them off here anyway.

Thanks for the info, Jack. Going with the compression argument, older FMs are safe, perhaps the newer ones will need more investigation. We don't want to enforce a blanket ban on all FM sources since obviously there is no lossy source involved with a 1989 FM like the one I seeded recently. Should it come to light that all recent FM broadcasts have lossy in their lineage then perhaps we should make a "cutoff date". I believe, however, that there are still many FM stations that are broadcasting "traditional" non-mp3-sourced stuff.

[RainDawg]

Originally Posted by wharfrat73

How is it that FM is allowed and XM is not? ...just curious

XM radio is a pay service that has specific agreements for users to not record and reproduce any of the material. The staff has decided we do not wish to endorse the seeding of XM radio material on our tracker.

[wharfrat73]

All FM sources are lossy. They always have been. The question is is there a less loss source available. That, my friends, is a fine line to walk; is there - will there ever be - a TRUE SBD source available or is the best available a lossy frequency modulated source.

[Jackstraw_1969]

Originally Posted by Five

Thanks for the info, Jack. Going with the compression argument, older FMs are safe, perhaps the newer ones will need more investigation. We don't want to enforce a blanket ban on all FM sources since obviously there is no lossy source involved with a 1989 FM like the one I seeded recently. Should it come to light that all recent FM broadcasts have lossy in their lineage then perhaps we should make a "cutoff date". I believe, however, that there are still many FM stations that are broadcasting "traditional" non-mp3-sourced stuff.

Keep in mind it also depends on what is being seeded. Is it live in the studio? Is it a concert broadcast from MSG? If it's the latter it gets stepped on up and down, and that is before the STL's get it. The live in the studio still has to go through the STL's tho, and all STL's wether microwave or ISDN compress.......

[wharfrat73]

Originally Posted by RainDawg

XM radio is a pay service that has specific agreements for users to not record and reproduce any of the material. The staff has decided we do not wish to endorse the seeding of XM radio material on our tracker.

Is that true of artists that do not want their art distributed electronically as well?