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Lossy or Lossless? Please use this forum to post spectral and frequency analysis posts about shows you have your doubts about. |
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#1
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Some opinions/help, please.
Today I recieved some shows and some are suspictious to me.
The shows are from one of my favorite bands and I like to get some opinions about the recordings. Especially since the lineages are not known Show 1 Guano Apes - Gurten 2000 source info: fm sa: fa: sample: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=I5XKZ8C6 Seems okay to me Show 2 Guano Apes - Bizarre 2001 source info: unknown sa: fa: sample: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=XNSUEMH3 My thoughts/notes: I know this show is broadcasted on TV, not sure if this could explain the 10-12 kHz missing, maybe a bad [?] tranfer from TV. Filter is used? Show 3 Guano Apes - Porto 2002 (Student Academic Festival) source info: audience rating: B plus sa: fa: sample: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=3VYKVGH9 any ideas about source? md or dat maybe?? Show 4 Guano Apes - Lisbon 2002 (Student Academic Festival) source info: audience rating: B minous sa: fa: sample: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=TDOSJGY0 Blockiness.. mp3 sourced or md Show 5 Guano Apes - Lisbon 2003 (coliseum) source info: Micro Panasonic RP VC 200 to MD Sony MZR 70 sa: fa: sample: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=N6IMFXEN bad mic or low recording settings/mode?? It's an old md model... No members have liked this post.
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#2
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Re: Some opinions/help, please.
1. Definitely FM, but is suspect to me. Check out this part in the FA. Some pretty clear blockiness.
2. Weird for sure. The whole damn thing is mirrored around the 10-12 split. Really bad transfer or upsample is my (barely educated) guess. 3. I think it's lossy, looks like MD a bit but I don't find the upturned parapets in the blocky parts. 4. Wayyyy lossy. Smells like mp3. 5. Well first of all, it's mono. Looks and sounds lossless to me, maybe recorded with only one mic and some whacky recording setting where the recorder only got a tiny bit of the sound. So those are my guesses. Correct me if I'm wrong folks. No members have liked this post.
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#3
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Re: Some opinions/help, please.
1. yeah, that is lossy and has to be from the station or you wouldn't see the carrier up top. If it was encoded after recording and/or digitization there would be black up top. also gotta say that is an awful mix the way the hihats are breathing, but that's off-topic
2. this is a rare case, I've only seen it a few times. it is a mirror image with the "death star groove" down the middle. I have a vhs I transferred about a year and a half ago that a friend of mine taped off Canadian tv around 1997 and I took the audio from my hifi vcr into a soundblaster live! card and it looked exactly like that. I can't explain it, but I'm quite sure it is lossless. 3. that's gotta be MD (atrac) transferred thru the analog input of a soundcard. 4. can't really tell with this one... there's no direct evidence I can find other than the cutoff. I would guess it is the result of a terrible transfer due to the sample rate being set 12kHz which is the kind of setting you would use for speech. I wouldn't trade this, see if you can track down the master and get a proper transfer of it. or trade it one on one with a heavy warning and only if the is the only known source on earth!
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#4
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Re: Some opinions/help, please.
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1) Do you mean the radiostation did not broadcast the show properly. Thus there won't be a better source around? or is did the recorder something wrong and it turned out bit lossy/blockiness? 2) ok, so it's safe to trade it [of course, I would tell them about the weird sa/fa and five's experience/explanation] 3) also okay, asuming there is no other source then the MD? 4) Will try to track the taper, until then non-trading/trade with warning (sound isn't so good anyway). 5) Will also try to track down the taper, to find out if this is the best out there (altought mp3 recording could have been better) No members have liked this post.
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#5
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Re: Some opinions/help, please.
1. He means that the station broadcast lossy audio. Not uncommon lately.
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#6
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Re: Some opinions/help, please.
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I don't think there is another source anyway, but is this "better" than mp3? Also five what's: hihats (it's something from the drumkit isn't it?) No members have liked this post.
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#7
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Re: Some opinions/help, please.
I wouldn't trade it. It's just mp3 broadcast over the radio. Any lossy sources are bad to trade.
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#8
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Re: Some opinions/help, please.
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I get the point, but how come the there's isn't any "blacked" (as in missing) frequencies? Wouldn't the mp3 have a cutoff (somewhere) and then the carrier above it .. or is the e.g. 15-17 kHz purple area just noise??? Also can you maybe tell me where you see the blockiness (time-freq or cirlcle/arrow in pic), because to be honest I don't see it.. at all! Guess it's a good thing I asked, because to me it seemed ok! [i wish i was better in analysing. I know the theory, but practice...] show 4 update: With a little bit of help of a friend I found the taper. Turned out he let people download his recordings after you sent him an e-mail. Actually, I have done this in the past, lost the second part, ask him for a re-upload/log-in.. without any reply. Lately I tried to e-mail him again in the hope to get a lossless/better copy, but again no reply. Makes me think he doesn't use that e-mail anymore, but i will give it one more try... The files he shared, were 128kbits mp3's [recording was done with md, not sure if he used headphones/mic]. I still have the mp3 version, so I made a fa/sa for comparison. Looks very similair to the ones posted earlier!!! Good part, same friend told me there exist a second source (mic+md), with less talking. Unfortunally that source is not complete, but only two songs or so missing is not so bad.. No members have liked this post.
Last edited by *dJ*; 2006-05-13 at 07:55 PM. |
#9
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Re: Some opinions/help, please.
1. yeah, the radiostation broadcast it from a lossy source. this is unfortunately becoming more common in recent years it might be possible to get a version that is not lossy from somebody inside the station, this is the best you will find until something (maybe) leaks out. There is no black at the top because noise got in there when it was broadcast, also you can see the carrier (red stripe up there). hihats are those two cymbals that are like a sandwich that opens and closes drummers are always using.
2. yes, that is my opinion. 3. yes 4. yeah... the new mp3 source looks similar, perhaps somebody deleted off the top of it to hide the mp3 ugliness?? not too sure what is up with that. if you can find the taper or somebody who knows him you could get some answers and maybe a better version. missed 5 before, my comments about 4 last post should have been about show 5 :oops: 5. looks like mp3 is mp3 and the FLAC vers is also from the mp3. hopefully you can get a lossless version!
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#10
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Re: Some opinions/help, please.
ps here is a copy of slimeruky's screenshots with some blocks (looks more like "hyphens" here) circled and an arrow showing where the abrupt cutoff it.
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#11
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Re: Some opinions/help, please.
About the FM, don't think I can get it from the station. Especially since it's broadcasted 5 or 6 years ago, but if I could it would still be lossy (without the noise) woudn't it?
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When and in which file do you say the deletion is made to hide the mp3 ugliness? I think I am missing the point here.. Found the taper, but I doubt he is still using that e-mail account. The best option left is I can get ahold of the other (incomplete) source.. Quote:
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#12
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Re: Some opinions/help, please.
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#13
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Re: Some opinions/help, please.
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Settings crap (like suggested by slimeruky) or bad transfer/encoding? No members have liked this post.
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#14
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Re: Some opinions/help, please.
really can't say... I'm leaning towards mp3 but if I am wrong then it is worse sound than most mp3 anyways.
esp considering how recent that show is there is something seriously wrong with that copy. I would avoid trading it and ask around for a different version.
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#15
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Re: Some opinions/help, please.
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#2: I´ve seen badly upsampled mp3s looking like this. No members have liked this post.
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