[boxedart]

I would also like to see the lineage on the VH Largo show clarified as well. I was the one who brought it up and I find it slighty amusing that when I brought up the 8mm part of the lineage I was told:

Originally Posted by sabkisscrue

Well first of all you didnt read the lineage correctly

I repsonded and I restated sabkisscrue's linege as they had listed it and I also posted screengrabs of one of the flaws contained in this new version that is not in the BTB version. And I asked:

Originally Posted by boxedart

On the other hand you could take the time to explain why your "Master Reels (3/4 inch tape) > Master VHS > 1st gen 8mm" source is in worse shape than BTB's "Low Gen. VHS" is.

That question was never answered, nor were my questions about the 8mm step:

So, once again, I made an attempt to explain the lineage - as was posted by sabkisscrue - and also made an attmept to clarify if sabkisscrue was also duece8pro. No direct answer was given but I did bring up the VHT thread in which duece8pro said this new version is:

Originally Posted by duece8pro

...what I think is the best version of Largo 82. Sourced from a 1st gen 8mm copy off a master vhs that came off the reels.

So I questioned the use of "master" and "1st gen" because a dub of a dub in not a "1st gen". I also brought up the fact that the end of the show was missing and that other versions exist with the complete show. In response to that I was responsed to with:

Originally Posted by sabkisscrue

...you were wrong about the lineage. After another try, you finally got it right. But this time you managed to twist my words around, even though you said at the beginning of your post you werent gonna do that, you managed to do that by stipulating or insuniating that the lineage is or may not be accurate.

So I again, this time very specifically, stated:

Originally Posted by boxedart

you are the one who is saying this version originated from "Master Reels (3/4 inch tape)", not me. You are the one saying it was dubbed to a "Master VHS", not me. You are the one saying it was dubbed onto 8mm, not me. You are the one implying this is from a second gen dub, not me.

And the response this time was:

Originally Posted by sabkisscrue

Well, you have continued to stipulate a great deal about the lineage that it cannot be sourced from the master because the picture contains a flaw or two and that the video is incomplete, by a few mins. I think your stipulations are ludicrous as well as your long, long posts

It needs to be noted at this point other people had posted about the quality and that this new version contained glitches/flaws that were not found in the BTB version, And each one was responded to with a "well, you are wrong" type of answer by sabkisscrue.

And here we are now. Because of the questionable lineage on the VH Largo show and the use of terms such as "master" and "1st Gen" I am now questioning the lineage of all that duece8pro/sabkisscrue has done. Look over their "resume" posted in this thread - how many say "1st"? Based on this discussion and the one on the VH Largo thread, if you believe the lineage than a dub was made onto VHS from the venue masters (A 1st Gen) and than dubbed onto 8mm (A 2nd gen) and than dubbed onto a stand alone DVD recorded (A 3rd Gen if you want to be accurate). The burned DVD was sent to someone else to author and output with "no re-encoding", and it was presented here. However it is important to note that duece8pro/sabkisscrue uses the terms "Master VHS" and "1st Gen 8mm" to describe these, assumedly, 1st and 2nd gen sources. To me that is not an accurate lineage.

If you add onto all of this the various conversations going on there are far more questions that answers now. I read the same thing AAR.oner, and others, have read. Just an overview of this thread so far as it relates to the post-production question:

The VH show:
Lineage according to sabkisscrue:

Master Reels (3/4 inch tape) > Master VHS > 1st gen 8mm >
Sony TRV-740 Digital8 Camera with TBC/DNR > firewire > JVC DRM-100 Dvd Recorder >
XP mode > 2 dvd-r SA Authored with ac3 audio > Reauthored on a DUAL LAYER by Skulljam9 without Re-Encoding

On the topic at hand:

Originally Posted by sabkisscrue

The point is, you need an aggressive amount of filtering to clean up vhs chroma and luminance noise. My equipment does the job, period and im willing to prove that.

Originally Posted by awolfoutwest

My preferred method is to capture to avi, spend some time looking at different filter results, then encode with the best processing I can determine for that video. I look at the video through software Vectorscope and Waveform Monitor apps to see how the color ranges conform to broadcast standards, then tweak black level and other proc amp stuff as needed. I wouldn't want to rely on a solely hardware chain because I can't go back and tweak things later.

Originally Posted by boxedart

I understand this is just a hobby and also understand that, when it comes to restoration, there is more to it than just popping a dub of a dub into a camera or VTR, hitting play, and than hitting record on a stand alone DVD burner.

Originally Posted by sabkisscrue

Based on the results ive gotten, yes I would say emphatically
it is one of the best if not the best methods to transfer most vhs/svhs tapes.[SNIP]There are different definitions of great that all apply to me and what I do:
1. My upgrades are of importance and significance in the trading community. People enjoy and love them because people like myself search out for this stuff.
2. I do a great job
3. Im someone who has achieved a lot by working hard and putting a lot of effort into
finding low gen upgrades and producing them, therefore I am one of the greats in the entire trading and collecting community.

Originally Posted by AAR.oner

...as you've admitted before, you know or do nothing in regards to color balance & correction, cleaning up the picture or audio, or any sort of post-production whatsoever.

Originally Posted by sabkisscrue

Admitted? Are you serious? I do all that actually. But you dont wanna believe that.

Originally Posted by AAR.oner

...according to every show you've u/led here, and the ones i've run across searching real quick, its nothing but a bunch of built-in "processors" on yer deck and camcorder passthroughs...no post production whatsoever...which then begs the question, if yer not lying here & you "do all that actually" -- are you lying on yer lineages?

Originally Posted by sabkisscrue

We're not gonna get into minutia.

Originally Posted by boxedart

Oh - and as for the whole post production thing - do you even know what that means? Every time you have "discussed" what you do you say all you do is hit play on one source and hit record on another. You then say you send that stand alone burned DVD out to someone else for "authoring". If anyone is remotely close to doing any post on your work it is the person who is doing the authoring.

Originally Posted by sabkisscrue

This is what this thread has come down to, a couple of peoples mentally ill obsession with the minutia as well as every single word or sentence I have to say. You two can carry on and on and on and on for as long as you like, its not gonna change what I do, its not gonna affect what I do, and its not gonna dictate what I do. I will continue to do what I do because I know I am the best at it.

Originally Posted by AAR.oner

you conveniently failed to answer the question about the post-production/restoration work you said yer doing to these transfers, or as you call it "minutia" [first time i've ever heard video restoration referred to as "minor or minute"]...its been brought to my attention that the VBT mods are very much interested in knowing yer answer as well...so do you plan to elaborate on said minutiae?

Originally Posted by boxedart

So if Lordsmurf said to you that post production takes a lot more work than what you are doing you would tell them the same thing?

Originally Posted by lordsmurf

It ranges from hours to days to weeks to months to years -- it really depends on the goals of the project and the source available.

Originally Posted by sabkisscrue

No, I never said I did any post-production work. You extracted whatever you wanted out of my response to a question where you asked about multiple things. What is clear to me is you have a vendetta against me. You are asking for answers to immaterial questions that you know the answer to already.

Originally Posted by AAR.oner

you said you did post work on yer transfers [color correction, picture/audio restoration, etc], i asked what since yer lineages didn't seem to reflect that, and then you say i'm attacking you?! its all right here in this thread for fuck's sake!!!

i will ask again, because i'm staff here and have every right to ask -- Do you or do you not do any picture/audio restoration, color correction/RGB balance, brightness/contrast, etc? a simple yes or no will do...not a big deal if you don't, you've simply alluded to it before and it seemed to not match the lineage you posted..