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Old 2009-03-04, 04:56 PM
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katnapz katnapz is offline
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Join Date: Nov 2004
"Audio BitTorrent Seeding Guide/Policy" Addition Suggestion

Long story short: This torrent:
was posted here at TTD. The poster obtained it from usenet. He modified it (track cuts) and FLAC'd it from it's original SHNs (WAV conversion in between). Then when he posted the torrent he didn't post the original checksums from the SHN's. After doing some comparisons on my end, and asking if there had been checksums with the original SHNs he noted that there had been and these matched the one's I presented to him.

I believe that due to the "long toothed" nature of digital media...that "conversions" such as in this Billy Joel torrent will become more common over time.

My reference to this particular torrent isn't a poke at the torrent poster, however as you can see from the dialog between us it probably would've been easier to track down the digital history of this version of this show by checksum comparison than by comparing them in Cool Edit as he suggested.

Point 1: Some are going to (and are already) view the SHN file format as old school or not modern enough, so they will convert to FLAC "just because" or "it saves upload/download time as it's smaller in FLAC."
Although I can't point out by URL here or on other sites this happening off the top of my head, I do know that I have seen torrents where a poster has stated as much.

Point 2: Someone who "remasters" a show who's original format was SHN, will more than likely change their output to FLAC. And when remastering (or even simply converting) people have a tendency to rename the individual tracks which adds to confusion. Plus the original checksums are no longer valid even if converted back to SHN (or whatever format). This holds true for FLAC to FLAC remasters as well.

Point 3: In either of these cases, the lineage up to the point of conversion is lost. At the most the poster will comment something about "I took this show posted by "X" and remastered it." This has the potential to add confusion to the trading pool...without a way to compare to the original file format (SHN) using checksum files (i.e., md5s) you could have the exact same show floating around in different formats.

Recommendation 1: So, keeping this in mind, I would like to submit a request that in the "Audio BitTorrent Seeding Guide," ( at around step 4 a comment be included that if a show has been converted from a different lossless format, that the old previously existing checksums be included within the info file. Further/in addition, at step 6 the recommendation be that the old checksum file be included for historical tracking purposes.

Recommendation 2: And in the "Audio BitTorrent Seeding Policy" ( around step 9, a statement that any checksums previously associated with the show be included in the info file. Also in step 10 that previously existing checksums be included in the torrent.

Personally I'd recommend both requiring embedding in the info file, and as a separate file when a torrent is posted - there's less chance of the info file being jettisoned by uncaring traders as a "what the? I don't need this," than an uncaring trader going into the info file and purposely deleting text within it.

Thanks for reading and any suggestions/inputs. Hope this makes sense....ask if not so I can clarify.
...Catnip is my middle name...
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