Problems burning dual layer DVDs

[Tubular]

I've been having some trouble burning dual layer DVDs. Initially I used Nero, and while it would burn and verify OK, sometimes it would change the .IFO and .BUP files and the menus wouldn't work properly. So I switched to ONES v2.0.330, and at first the discs would burn and verify OK and play fine. Then I started to have problems with the DL discs burning and verifying with ONES (they would fail verification right away and eject). The DL discs wouldn't play in my standalone, and most of the files on the DL disc burned with ONES were altered, including most .VOB files (they wouldn't match the original md5 if I ripped it back to the HD using windows or DVD decrypter). Does anybody know what is going on and why ONES would alter the files and/or otherwise screw up the burn? I see an update at the ONES site. Will that help? I think I started to have problems with ONES after I did a Nero update, so I uninstalled both Nero and ONES, then reinstalled ONES. This didn't fix the problem, I still had problems burning DLs with ONES. I stopped burning DLs for a while until recently. I was able to successfully burn 3 DL discs with ONES (they verified OK and play fine in standalones). Then I coastered 2 DL discs in a row as my problems burning with ONES reappeared. :mad: I decided to give IMG Burn a shot, which was seemingly burning the DL disc fine until the lead out, at which point it failed.

The discs I've been using are Verbatim DVD+R DL. I always burn DL discs at 2.4X speed. I always restart the computer before every burn and have no other programs running besides the burning app. and a couple tray items (like AVG antivirus) when I burn. Windows Disk Defragmenter says I don't need to defragment my drive right now. The computer itself is getting old and is kind of a POS: 800 MHz Pentium III, 256 MB RAM, Windows XP Home. Drive is a Lite-On slim type for laptops.

Is there a way to burn a DVD-Video disc in Nero without the chance that it will alter any .IFO and .BUP files? I tried ISO mode in Nero burning ROM and my standalone couldn't read the disc, although it burned and verified OK and played fine on my PC.

I should add that I have no trouble at all burning single layer DVDs with ONES in data mastering mode or record VIDEO_TS mode, and I burn them all the time. A single layer disc I burned recently with ONES got a 93 score in Nero DiscSpeed > Disc Quality with these stats:

[Drewa311]

ill say it once and ill say it again, FUCK dual layer

shady instable format you should stay away from

[Homebrew101]

I have only had success using Verbatim DL blanks, maybe it's your burner not the blanks or Ones software.

[retired]

Tubular, since this started with you updating nero, it likely has something to do with that. Even though you re-installed both ONES & Nero, that update is what's causing a problem. Since you're using the same discs, it could be your burner is on the way out. I'd uninstall nero all together (unless you use it for audio) and try a different brand of duals (ridata puts out good ones) I use HP's for the most part but that's more out of default because I only have 2 places to buy discs from and I never think to get them online.
ill say it once and ill say it again, FUCK dual layer

shady instable format you should stay away from
Just because you have problems doesn't mean everyone else does. I have just as many issues with single layers as I do with duals (virtually none).

I'll repeat, if there were something actually wrong with the data on the discs, your splitting method would not work or fix it.

[Drewa311]

I have only had success using Verbatim DL blanks, maybe it's your burner not the blanks or Ones software.

looks like he had problems ^^^^

why don't you just admit that DLs are shady and they ain't worth shit?

its obvious that dvd5 is way more stable and they will win in the long run

the technology just isnt there, no matter how much you want it to be, just so you can have your extra 4 GB, when i use DL i feel like im buring a cd in 1997 hoping it will make it to 100%


i know im not helping much! but if i were you i would stay away from DLs or split or compress them, just dont trade them, cause some people will be pissed for "altering" the lineage

[saltman]

There are just as many posts with people that are using failing DVD burners (this one happens to be sketchy to begin with) that have problems burning DVD5s. troll somewhere else.

[Drewa311]

troll somewhere else.

:wave:

[pawel]

Try free & great: http://www.imgburn.com

Please note that a DL has to have set layer break in IFO/BUP files. If the info is not contained, Imgburn will ask where to place the break, and will change IFO/BUP.

[possessed]

The problem may be as simple as the burner doesn't work well with the brand of DL discs used. I only use media certified and tested by the drive manufacturer as "recommended." Once I started doing that my coaster ratio has been nearly zero.

[KCMoeJoe]

I was having no luck (getting failed burns) with two different media brands, then I went to the manufacturer's website for my DVD burner and downloaded the latest firmware update and was go to go burning dual layers after that.

[Tubular]

I just tried playing a couple of DL discs I burned with Nero a few months ago in DVD-ROM UDF/ISO mode with Nero burning ROM. They played fine in a Denon player but wouldn't play in an XBOX 360. There are three main options for UDF: automatic, manual, and XBOX compatibilty mode. In the manual mode, there are these options: physical partition, virtual partition, and sparable partition. Then there are different versions of UDF that can be used: 1.02, 1.50, 2.00, 2.01, 2.50, 2.60. Which one should I use? Which one does ONES use? In ONES' data mastering mode, the mode that I usually burn all my DVD-videos with, it uses ISO + UDF but doesn't say the specific version of UDF that it uses (all my discs play fine in several different players using this). Since I've never had problems with Nero burning DL discs (other than changing .IFO and .BUP files in crappy Express mode), I think I'll try that again. I just updated to ONES v2.1.358, so maybe I'll try that again too. Thanks for the responses.

There are just as many posts with people that are using failing DVD burners (this one happens to be sketchy to begin with) that have problems burning DVD5s. troll somewhere else.

My Lite On isn't that great of a drive? What slim type internal drive would you recommend? I can't seem to find a Plextor slim type on Newegg or Tigerdirect. One thing that really sucks about this particular Lite On is that the CD read speeds SUCK. I can only read CDs at about 1.00X - 2.00X, so if I want to rip a CD it takes fucking forever.

[pawel]

Then there are different versions of UDF that can be used: 1.02, 1.50, 2.00, 2.01, 2.50, 2.60.
For Xbox you have to check option under the UDF tab "Force DVD-Video compatibility mode (required for Xbox TM)", and use UDF 1.02 only - like for any DVD.

[Homebrew101]

I guess I wasn't clear in my language, let me clarify: I have never had a coaster using Verbatim DL with either of my dvd burners.

Is that clear now Drewa311?

[Drewa311]

wait...explain again... your dual layers suck and will be useless because of data rot in 3 years? I think i understand now!

youll have problems...just wait

[hkdave]

the only dvd9s that i have had problems with have been Memorex. they completely freeze not only my burner but the entire pc as well. very strange.

i usually use verbatim dls, although i have also had success with ridata too. i have found that burning speed also makes quite a difference in the number of bad burns i get, for me it's the slower the speed, the better.

also had some troubles w/ the layer break in nero, as mentioned above imgburn is excellent for that.

[Drewa311]

DL tech just isnt there for the home consumer...if it was, where is the quad layer? i refuse to believe that DLs will stand the test of time, its really almost a joke to me...who the fuck cares about an extra 4 GB? there is a reason dvd production companies use high quality burners and discs, so when the consumer BUYS the dvd he doesnt get it home and have it be a coaster, and so there not wasting discs. Now we got blu-ray burners, DLs will be the new way of burning blu-rays without buying 25$ blank blu ray discs, too bad all you quality freak TTDers will be forced to split or compress your blu rays for them to fit on DLs. please let know know if im completely off base! id like to not care some more!

[Drewa311]

http://www.engadget.com/2006/06/22/mitsubishis-30gb-dual-layer-hd-dvd-r-media-ready-in-july/

this is more like it!

just wait for the 100 GB discs, 5 years and all you chumps will be kicking yourself because no one will remember DLs, but you'll have a full library, kinda like 8tracks!

theres a time to jump on the bandwagon, ive realized its best to chill and wait for the technology to catch up with itself

[Homebrew101]

http://www.engadget.com/2006/06/22/mitsubishis-30gb-dual-layer-hd-dvd-r-media-ready-in-july/

this is more like it!

just wait for the 100 GB discs, 5 years and all you chumps will be kicking yourself because no one will remember DLs, but you'll have a full library, kinda like 8tracks!

theres a time to jump on the bandwagon, ive realized its best to chill and wait for the technology to catch up with itself


Read the date in your link. 2006-06-22! That link is HD-DVD which is already dead. Blu-Ray blank prices will drop as the market develops. Of course there will be something to make every format obsolete at some point. Cassettes made 8-Track a dinosaur but now who uses cassettes? You can't always "sit out" and wait for something else to come along.

Do you buy any movies on DVD? Those are DL, why waste your $$$ when those are already surpassed with Blu-Ray soon to be outmoded by something down the road.

I will not wait 5 years to upgrade from DVD5 to a 100GB disc. I have no problems with DL now, sure I wish blanks were 25 cents like DVD5 but I don't like people compressing 8GB shows with DVD Shrink to fit it on a DVD5 because they a cheap SOB.

[retired]

too bad all you quality freak TTDers will be forced to split or compress your blu rays for them to fit on DLs. please let know know if im completely off base! id like to not care some more!
Wrong yet again. Actually, once blu-ray's start being seeded here, unless the taper does 2 versions (blu-ray & dual layer), the only version seedable here will be the blu-ray.

Give it some time, you'll be whining about how bad blu-rays suck, they're so expensive, they're unstable media, blah blah blah...I put everything on single layers cuz its the only stable format.

If you don't like the standards, why exactly are you here?
Read the date in your link. 2006-06-22! That link is HD-DVD which is already dead.
:lol:

[wilson]

I guess I wasn't clear in my language, let me clarify: I have never had a coaster using Verbatim DL with either of my dvd burners.

Is that clear now Drewa311?


wait...explain again... your dual layers suck and will be useless because of data rot in 3 years? I think i understand now!

youll have problems...just wait


how old are you 12 ? its the same technology

I use verbatim media and have no problems.... you might be running into problems due to cheap discs

i have a feeling that high prices of dvd9s has some correlation to commercial dvds being dvd9....
and is the reason why blue-ray burning isn't to prevalent and why the discs cost so much

[Jetrell69]

Burn at the lowest speed, wait a little bit longer, the finished DL is WELL worth the effort...that simple.

I use them for mostly storage but when I do a movie, imgburn & go, a definite NO-brainer.

:)

[greenheatherc]

its really almost a joke to me...who the fuck cares about an extra 4 GB?


Discs are not just used for storage so it's not just a matter of 4 extra gigs. It's being able to burn a show without compressing it or having to change discs half-way through.

[Drewa311]

DLs suck and always will...end of story (maybe not in 5/10 years)

simply put i have lower standards of media than most people here on TTD, being that i collect .mp3 DJs set i see no reason on spending and extra $.75 just for another 4 gigs of space when i can pop in another disc and burn that no problem, ive always kinda looked at people here on TTD as media snobs, kinda like the smug episode of south park. Im a kid and like to save my money for food, books, bars etc. Im being as resourceful as i can and i encourage other to do the same, if DLs are so great why doesnt Taiyo Yuden make them? I cherish my media just as much as the next person and thats why i dont burn on DLs...because they are shitty and wont stand the test of time.

why no quad-layer?

and i seriously feel sorry for anyone over 30 who has posted in this topic...shouldnt you be at work or taking care of you kids instead of defending DLs...half the reason i even post here is to get a rise out of you TTD nerds who have nothing better to do than bitch to me about how DLs superior...my advice to you is to get a life and or wife/kids and not burn on DLs if you REALLY cherish quality media.

on the bright side, the suckers who spend an extra $.75 a disc for clearly more ink on the same disc you are the ones that are supporting the coming of new technology that will become the new standard whether DLs, Blu-ray, neon disc. 10 years from now ill jump on the bandwagon thinking back, wow thanks to all the chumps that helped stabilize X media format by spending more than twice what they could be for the same shit. but for now im content with 4.7 GB discs, because im not a fat lazy computer nerd who opposes compression/ getting up im the middle of a disc (way too much effort, especially when that mikes groove ends half way through, BUZZ KILL)

Man i really cant belive i just wrote that much, i fell like one of you, maybe i should pull a kostanza/wickerman and quit while im ahead


gg allin shits on dual layers

[Drewa311]

wait...explain again... your dual layers suck and will be useless because of data rot in 3 years? I think i understand now!

youll have problems...just wait


how old are you 12 ? its the same technology

I use verbatim media and have no problems.... you might be running into problems due to cheap discs

i have a feeling that high prices of dvd9s has some correlation to commercial dvds being dvd9....
and is the reason why blue-ray burning isn't to prevalent and why the discs cost so much


clealry its not the same technolgy, unless you have one of those HUGE burners that are used to pump out thousands of discs, thats why yours are purple and movies are silver

ive used all types of DLs with varying success rates, my system is fine dual core 2 BG ram, one phillips burner and one sony, i just find that DLs are the less economical way to go. everything will become more stable with time, thats why i back everything up on floppy discs and jump drives!

[shopkin]

DLs suck and always will...end of story (maybe not in 5/10 years).......
gg allin shits on dual layers
agreed!:thumbsup



if the only difference is not having to change the dvd half way thru the show.....fuck DVD9......
my new burner gets here today....cant wait to try it out.......
o and old VHS to DVD9?.....:wtf: why?
imho...


and whats the cost on DVD9's now?? i havent bought any in awhile.....

[Drewa311]

DLs suck and always will...end of story (maybe not in 5/10 years).......
gg allin shits on dual layers
agreed!:thumbsup



if the only difference is not having to change the dvd half way thru the show.....fuck DVD9......
my new burner gets here today....cant wait to try it out.......
o and old VHS to DVD9?.....:wtf: why?
imho...


and whats the cost on DVD9's now?? i havent bought any in awhile.....


$1.40 a disc can S a D

http://www.supermediastore.com/dvd-plus-r-dual-double-layer-section.html

[shopkin]

thanks drew.... fuck i was paying like 15.00 for 3 memorex at staples....f that.
i guess at 1.40 a disc i can burn a few more coasters and not worry about it....
i could never make heads or tails over DVD9... some would work and some dont..
does it have anything to do with the way the files were auther'd...i have always use the same dics(see above) and the same burner....(XX (https://eshop.macsales.com/shop/firewire/optical-drives/))
just could'nt get on a roll.......

[Drewa311]

thanks drew.... fuck i was paying like 15.00 for 3 memorex at staples....f that.
i guess at 1.40 a disc i can burn a few more coasters and not worry about it....
i could never make heads or tails over DVD9... some would work and some dont..
does it have anything to do with the way the files were auther'd...i have always use the same dics(see above) and the same burner....(XX (https://eshop.macsales.com/shop/firewire/optical-drives/))
just could'nt get on a roll.......

im assuming your younger and less of a dorm than most people posting in this topic

you can always MAKE it work if you want to

most these people here probably rage netfilx and dont take the extra step to compress, because they have dope HD tvs or dont want get up in the middle of a feature film as if they were using laserdiscs

DLs are the minority...thats why gg allin shits on them while fucking your grandmas throat with his shit covered dick

i think that about wraps things up

FUCKING JERK STORE

[Tubular]

damn that's some hard core language and resentment for something in a technobabble thread. :lol :disbelief

[shopkin]

maybe not younger,just not any smarter....
i could never MAKE those things work... im clueless as far as where to begin if the
DVD stops burning because of an error....i guess that what you mean as far as the home consumer...ya?(though im probably a bit below average) i dont see any DVD5 burning problem threads.... so why do 9's have so many more issues than 5's? i know im not alone here...(hello hello??) anyway i do think its worth the time and effort(& $) to make them work every time. ill choose to compress for the time being and do trades to get the hi res if needed.......

[shopkin]

whats a blue ray?:rolleyes:

[shopkin]

.... so why do 9's have so many more issues than 5's? .......

:hmm:

[Tubular]

whats a blue ray?:rolleyes:

http://www.videohelp.com/hd

25 gigs on a single layer disc, and 50 gigs on a dual layer disc. It uses a blue laser vs. a red laser. Blue lasers can focus on smaller pits than red lasers, so they can store more data.

It's the new high definition disc format that will replace DVDs.

Blu-Ray won the format war. HD-DVD was the loser.

[shopkin]

:lol:

[retired]

maybe not younger,just not any smarter....
i could never MAKE those things work... im clueless as far as where to begin if the
DVD stops burning because of an error
Likely the type of discs you were using or NERO, if you're still using that worthless program?
If you haven't trying a different brand of discs, do that.
Before you attempt to burn one, reboot your comp and burn before you re-connect to torrents or start searching the web. Let all your comps resources go to burning the disc. :thumbsup

[shopkin]

i was useing the said memorex disc i was getting raped for...
and im on a mac so its toast 8. all the other stuff has been common practice for me,
but i havent done one in a long while, and my new burner is to get here today, guess ill have to get some different 9's and see how it goes.........:wave:

[shopkin]

you know i just threw out my old sig today.....
i might have found another......:lol:

[direwolf-pgh]

.... so why do 9's have so many more issues than 5's? .......

:hmm:because asking a computer to stream 4GB is a completely different task than asking it to stream 8GB.
just because you purchased a DL burner doesnt mean it will function to the standards required for proper playback.
those people currently having an issue burning DL discs prove the point as the rest of us are fine & have always have been fine.

sorry, im being wordy..

if you cant burn a DL, its because your equipment sucks.

[saltman]

.... so why do 9's have so many more issues than 5's? .......

:hmm:That is a myth perpetuated by people that need to research quality drives and media. Search here for people with trouble burning and you will see that it is common (people noted above) for both DVD5 and DVD9. I have burned two dual layer coasters and it was due to a bad drive that I had to replace. I have burned maybe 200 successful ones. I have never had a problem with playback. The computer than burned the majority of my duals (99 percent) was built in 2002. I consider it very outdated.

If you have a bad drive it will show up quicker with dual layer media for the reasons Wolf mentions above. It will eventually show it's head with DVD5 also if it is bad.

[Tubular]

Will flash drives someday replace optical discs? Would that be too expensive, and would the data not last as long? :hmm:

Shopkin, try Verbatim DVD+R DL. Memorex sucks, and DVD-R DL aren't that great I think.

[shopkin]

:banger2:
like i said the new burner gets here today!
heres to no more issues.....

[U2Lynne]

sorry, im being wordy..
Not as wordy as you were here: Microsoft Abandons Internet Explorer 7 (http://www.thetradersden.org/forums/showthread.php?t=54661)

(and it looks like someone didn't change the username correctly! :cool: - thread AND post table, dear, iff there is a userid!)

[Drewa311]

Im hoping for some sort of 3D flash drives, like a memory cube, that would be dope

am i not right, YOU ARE THE MINORITY as of now
DLs havnt stood the test of time as of yet, if they did they would be just as cheap and single layers.

blu-ray's dope , thats the type of shit im hoping for, not a worthless extra 4 gigs, once 100 GB disc become the standard is when ill switch, for now im not getting punked out buying shitty DLs i give it like 3-5 years till they are at where DLs are now.

and memorex do suck...im not doubting that all you burn DLs with 100% success rate but you must realize that your all minority nerds who have time/funding/knowledge base to make them work. the more i think about it, the more i realize that shit shitty format is being pushed on us with little price reduction to maximize profit.

[Drewa311]

reboot your comp and burn before you re-connect to torrents or start searching the web. Let all your comps resources go to burning the disc. :thumbsup

convenient huh?


i think id rather split it or switch discs, than have all my comp resources going to burn 4 extra gigs?

this conversation really makes me want to follow mr. marcel vogel-one of my heros, i bet if he were still alive we would even be talking about this, we would be well on our way to solid state storage

[shopkin]

......Shopkin, try Verbatim DVD+R DL. Memorex sucks......

.....and memorex do suck...

i guess this is where ill make my next change....
BTW......burner is here and have burned chicago 72(DVD5) just fine....
(what a great show). ill have to order some Verbatim 9's and do that test when they get here.....thanks for all the info guys....
:wave:

[Tubular]

...im not doubting that all you burn DLs with 100% success rate but you must realize that your all minority nerds who have time/funding/knowledge base to make them work. the more i think about it, the more i realize that shit shitty format is being pushed on us with little price reduction to maximize profit.

If you got a bunch of DVD9's and you wanted to copy them, you will spend a lot of time splitting and/or compressing them to DVD5.

[Drewa311]

...im not doubting that all you burn DLs with 100% success rate but you must realize that your all minority nerds who have time/funding/knowledge base to make them work. the more i think about it, the more i realize that shit shitty format is being pushed on us with little price reduction to maximize profit.

If you got a bunch of DVD9's and you wanted to copy them, you will spend a lot of time splitting and/or compressing them to DVD5.

you got it, im not lazy or a quality freak, it wasnt too long ago you had no choice but to spit/compress dvds, ill save my $.75 each disc for more valid ventures

[direwolf-pgh]

sorry, im being wordy..
Not as wordy as you were here: Microsoft Abandons Internet Explorer 7 (http://www.thetradersden.org/forums/showthread.php?t=54661)

(and it looks like someone didn't change the username correctly! :cool: - thread AND post table, dear, iff there is a userid!):duh: oh yeah.
thats why you run the show :love: shes good guys...shes real good.

[E_rock]

That link is not even funny.

[ChrisJ]

just wait for the 100 GB discs, 5 years and all you chumps will be kicking yourself because no one will remember DLs, but you'll have a full library, kinda like 8tracks!


Yep and it will take up 1/2 the size and have twice the quality of your DVD5s.

Hell, I am in the middle of transferring 1500 CDRs that have nothing but shn and a few flacs on them to DVD (5 at first and now DVD9). And you know what, before all those CDRs of lossless files, it was cassette tapes. 1000s of them over the years. And LOTS of pople have done it. This progression has been going a lot longer than you or I been around and it will continue.

It's your choice, you can either attempt to learn something new and progress with the rest of us, or you can stay where you are and continue to be a self-admitted troll. Simple as that.

And yes I am an 'old nerd' in your book. I started my own business in 1998, sold it 8 years later and retired at 33. Now I do sit around on the computer, probably a little too much.

And I laugh at people like you.

Oh, and no wife yet, my girlfriend said she would be jealous of another woman around the house.



Have a good one lil troll! :wave:

[Drewa311]

who said i couldnt burn DLs? i just choose not to

and i said the "standard" meaning when blu-ray is the standard MAJORITY in 5 years, ill go for it, now 4 GB isnt worth the extra $.75

you dont need to agree, its fact

dvd9s isnt the majority and i dont expect it to be any time soon

what it boils down to is that were all passionate nerd with too much time on our hands, you guys just have WAY to much time on your hands, i feel bad for you, because i feel like you wasting precious time arguing with me while you should be at your kids soccer game or attending you wifes/GFs bukake sessions or maybe burning more dvd9s, somthing a lil bit more productive, you obviously all know my stance on dvd9, PEOPLE WHO USE DVD9 ARE THE MINORITY, talk to me when that changes! or get a life and dont talk to me at all! I will always troll as long as you keep giving me troll bait.

chrisj = washed up internet dork with a tiny dick that no one here has ever heard of so:stfu:

edit- your cool in my book chris, that kraftwerk dvd9 is HOTT, once i split it of course!

you gunna catch any of the US shows? thats a show i would LOVE to see for sure, thanks for the UP, on that note, i dont mean the insults above nearly as much now that i saw your actually somewhat respectable musically

[Drewa311]

why doesnt a mod just ban me already, haven't i done enough to piss you people off?

its all in whoring love though

i wont bother you technohounds anymore, i promise!

[U2Lynne]

why doesnt a mod just ban me already, haven't i done enough to piss you people off?

its all in whoring love though

i wont bother you technohounds anymore, i promise!
Why ban you? I could care less if you prefer DVD5s instead of DVD9s. Who really cares? All I really care about is that I ask that you please not split a DVD9 and then seed it.

We are all adults here (I think, although sometimes I do wonder :hmm:) , shouldn't we be able to have differing opinions?

[Drewa311]

why doesnt a mod just ban me already, haven't i done enough to piss you people off?

its all in whoring love though

i wont bother you technohounds anymore, i promise!
Why ban you? I could care less if you prefer DVD5s instead of DVD9s. Who really cares? All I really care about is that I ask that you please not split a DVD9 and then seed it.

We are all adults here (I think, although sometimes I do wonder :hmm:) , shouldn't we be able to have differing opinions?

I LOVE YOU LYNNE

[direwolf-pgh]

:lol4: :lol4:

[retired]

We are all adults here (I think)?
You're the only one ;)

[direwolf-pgh]

well i like Drew more than any dvd5 or dvd9 disc anyway.. if that counts for anything. :)

(a blank one that is)

[mooncusser]

If a DVD9 was a true double, it would be a DVD10.
Stupid cheaters, stealing 1 from us every time we try to put 5 and 5 together.

[Tubular]

Lynne is the real thing. Even better than the real thing. :cool:

[Jetrell69]

damn that's some hard core language and resentment for something in a technobabble thread. :lol :disbelief

Agreed....and who REALLY cares. Some don't like, Some do like......individual opinions are NO need for "these suck" or "you suck"....unless you guys are giving out some sort of personal invitations to each other and that's your business too, we certainly don't need to know.

Give it a REST would ya.....you stated how you felt...beat a dead horse someplace else already.

:nono:

[direwolf-pgh]

chrisj = washed up internet dork with a tiny dick that no one here has ever heard of so:stfu:thats some funny shit. :lol4:

[wilson]

dvd9s isnt the majority and i dont expect it to be any time soon



almost every commerically pressed disc out there is a dvd9 ... how is that not the majority ?

and if your going to try to troll around the internet atleast get some facts to back up what your saying.... then you don't look like an idiot
---------------------------------------------------------------------

and seriously if buying a dvd9 is to expensive for people its time to sell your computer and stop burning discs / and cancel the internet because your one poor motherfucker

[shopkin]

:bump:
hope these will help.....